While yesterday's Star Trek Online dev chat was absent of devs due to illness, the Champions Online team was on-hand in its IRC chat to answer questions about PvP. Systems Designer Brian "Balseraph" Urbanek kicked things off by explaining that PvE is the primary focus of Champions Online, and the team will always err on its side if there's competing tension between PvE and PvP.

The team also discussed the new Zombie Apocalypse PvP scenario map, which will force heroes to fend off hordes of zombie NPCs for a certain amount of time. "The rumors that you can turn into a zombie hero are absolutely true!" PvP Designer James "Lucid" Laird said. One player will start off as a zombie hero on the side of the zombie NPCs and can't be permanently killed. The zombie hero will get points for picking off living heroes, who will then become zombies.

You can read the full transcript of the one-hour PvP discussion after the jump.

[15:57] <SavageSage> Deake before the chat starts can you tell us what stats will feed into Celestial for the healing effects?

[15:57] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Con and Presence will be the stats for Celestial (woo! bonus question and answer!)

[16:05] <~Cryptic_Daeke> Hello! Welcome to this special edition of the Champions Online Devchat!

[16:05] <~Cryptic_Daeke> This time around, the topic is PvP!

[16:05] <~Cryptic_Daeke> If you have questions to submit during chat, please type "/join #COquestions" and ask you question in the chat there.

[16:06] <~Cryptic_Daeke> If you'd like to talk during the chat, you can "/join #COchat" to talk with other players.

[16:06] <~Cryptic_Daeke> Now, as usual, some introductions.

[16:06] <~Cryptic_Daeke> I'm David "Daeke" Bass, Online Community Rep.

[16:07] <@Chronomancer> This is Bill Roper, EP on Champions Online and collector of flashy shoes.

[16:07] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Greetings, humans. I'm Brian "Balseraph" Urbanek, Systems Designer

[16:07] <@Cryptic_Lucid> I'm James "Lucid" Laird, PvP designer.

[16:07] <~Cryptic_Daeke> Alrighty, let's hop right into this.

[16:07] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <Levenant> Many have argued that changes to powers because of PVP have been hurting PVE and vice -versa. Will powers ever be changed in the future to have seperate effects in PVP/PVE to avoid the balancing problems that have angered so many fans and driven off so many players?

[16:08] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> PvE is and has been the primary focus of Champions Online, and if we find an place where the competing tension between the two absolutely cannot be resolved, we'll err on the side of PvE. That being said, however, we have yet to confront a situation where we felt that was true.

[16:08] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> As a case in point, I'd like to indicate our implementation of "taunt", with the Crippling Challenge advantage, which we feel works great in both. This power actually does have separate functionality, in that it doesn't FORCE other players to change targets the way it does to creatures, but rather has closely analogous utility in both areas.

[16:08] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> That power will, I think always be the model for attempting to balance the competing interests of those two play styles.

[16:09] <~COquestionbot> <Makasuro> Question: I know the next patch will take away dueling in the powerhouse, and from playing on the test shard it seems that before you can even duel someone, you have to ask them to join your team, load another instance, and then duel.

[16:09] <@Chronomancer> Removing dueling from the lobby was at the request of players, so we put it into it's own testing spot in the new Powerhouse design. We can certainly look at addingf in a more public setting where players can more easily do "pick up" duels and others can watch. At the Powerhouse, we're workign to meet the needs of our heroic guests!

[16:11] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Hoo hoo. I am so excited about ZombApoc.

[16:11] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Zombie Apocalypse is a brand-new PvP scenario map. When the game starts, most players will be Heroes, trying to fend off the ravenous hordes of zombie NPCs. Heroes earn points for protecting the cabin containing civilian survivors--mechanically, they have a "hill" to defend.

[16:11] <@Cryptic_Lucid> The rumors that you can turn into a zombie hero are absolutely true! One player will start off as a zombie hero, with a cool new costume but all of their original powers. The Zombie hero is outnumbered but has the support of the NPC zombies and can't be permanantly killed. The Zombie hero earns points for picking off the living heroes, who then become Zombies

[16:11] <@Cryptic_Lucid> The Heroes will find themselves having to defend the hill against more and more Zombie heroes, with fewer and fewer allies, until the inevitable end.

[16:12] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Mwahaha.

[16:12] <@Chronomancer> Played today. It's sick fun.

[16:12] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <Scorpius5> When will there be more Acclaim rewards added? Even if they are not costume unlocks and just items to wear for stats there need to be way more rewards to pick from. For lvl 40 there are only 2 items for each Secondary Slot and that's not enough...

[16:13] <@Cryptic_Lucid> How about... right away! When Blood Moon rolls out, we'll also be adding a new store of power replace items that can only be purchased with Acclaim.

[16:13] <@Cryptic_Lucid> We're also planning to add several new PvP upgrades with different stat combinations favoring builds that the PvP community is using now.

[16:14] <@Cryptic_Lucid> (Not necessarily with Blood Moon, but soon after.)

[16:14] <@Cryptic_Lucid> In general, if you want upgrades for a specific powerset, you can get those rewards from PvE play (as Nemesis and UNITY rewards). We don't want to duplicate all of those stat pairings in the PvP store; instead, PvP rewards are designed to support cross-framework builds, and have pairings of stats that you can't get anywhere else.

[16:14] <@Cryptic_Lucid> As we speak, Antiproton is sitting down with our datamining tool to figure out which superstats PvPers are using now. He'll then create PvP upgrades based on those superstat pairs.

[16:14] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <Smackwell> I'd like to know if anything is going to be done about Melee, especially charged Melee powers. In City of Heroes, as long as you started an attack next to someone, even if they walked away you'd hit them when your attack came through.

[16:15] <~Cryptic_Daeke> While I don't think it would be fair to get up next to someone and have them immediately jump away and still land a fully charged Haymaker on them, I think a grace period of, say, half a second should be given, so if they start moving away, we can let go of the charge and still hit them if we react quick enough.

[16:15] <~Cryptic_Daeke> It's very frustrating when my attack is completely doged just by taking a step back.

[16:15] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Melee under performs in PvP. You know it, we know it, and it is something we're going to address. The basic idea is simple: the melee player has to work harder than the ranged player to start doing damage, but once he gets his target locked down / snared / dazed / held / cornered / whatever,

[16:15] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> he should do much more damage per second, enough to end the fight in a win most of the time. Our analysis right now is that it's harder (or just less fun) than we want it to be for a melee character to actually get to unload their full broadside of damage, as opposed to not doing enough damage when they DO hit.

[16:15] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> So, things we're working on to make this easier - making the existing snares execute faster and be more interesting buttons to press in general, creating some standardized advantages that can be put onto many non charging melee attacks (including shuriken throw) that inflict snares on your target, and probably making any melee charged attacks that lock you do

[16:16] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> *down not do that.

[16:16] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Once we get those in, we'll watch carefully and reevaluate from there.

[16:17] <~COquestionbot> <Maelstrom> Something of a more generalized question, but it's key to pvp- are there any plans to prevent build changing while in combat?

[16:17] <@Chronomancer> No. In fact, that's sort of the point of builds - to be able to change your tactics in the mi9ddle of a combat. There *is* a cooldown on switching builds so that players can't "dance" back and forth between those.

[16:19] <~COquestionbot> <ProfessorWalsh> Question: Is there any imminent plans to deal with the situation in PVP revolving around the non-properly-functioning rank 2 and 3 Mindful Reinforcement?

[16:19] <~Cryptic_Daeke> I see what you did there.

[16:19] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> No!

[16:19] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> .... oh, wait, yes. It's already fixed internally, and just needs to go through the QA / PTS / etc. process.

[16:20] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <EuzaRaa> Will there be more fixes to improve on the state of the actual fighting in PvP? As many players have stated, there are alot of gimmicks to the game at the moment, like the safety of teleporting, and the cheapness of chain-knockback (I understand this is being worked on).

[16:21] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Regarding knockbacks - There already is a small diminishing return on knocks, but we recognize that it's still not really sufficient. Internally, we're experimenting with some other options. My personal favorite right now is adding explicit functionality to Unbreakable (and to some other powers via advantage) for an effect that explicitly ends a knock or

[16:21] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> repel effect and grants you a brief window of invulnerability to further effects. As to Teleport... basically, that's a victim of its own popularity. Basically, we're trying to figure out the best way to "fix" it (and we know and acknowledge the issues!) without making it less fun, and upsetting a whole lotta players. =)

[16:21] <~Cryptic_Daeke> I want to pause for a second to introduce Robobo

[16:22] <~Cryptic_Daeke> He's our Producer of Stuff.

[16:22] <@cryptic_robobo> say hi

[16:22] <~Cryptic_Daeke> And a reminder. If you have questions to ask during chat, go to #COquestions

[16:22] <~Cryptic_Daeke> And stick to the topic: PvP!

[16:22] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <JTWStephens> When you sit down and look at player powers, do you look at put an emphasis on PVP balance or PVE balance? Which do you look at first? Why?

[16:23] <@Chronomancer> As Brian said, PvE is and has been the primary focus of Champions Online, and if we find an place where the competing tension between the two absolutely cannot be resolved, we'll err on the side of PvE. That being said, we really don't want mechanics to work differently in PvE and Pvp, so the work is on us to make it all work.

[16:23] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Rage-Overkill: How will PVP actually affect PVE with bloodmoon and what will the effects of Werewolf disease and the celestial powerset on PVP related to PVE

[16:23] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Werewolf / Hunter game play is all "opt in". Werewolf / Hunter players can only attack Hunter players (and, of course, normal PvE enemies). The source that grants power to Celestial characters CAN, in fact cure the Lycanthropy disease!

[16:23] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Doing so is a massive ritual that will take several days of time, but will simultaneously cleanse the entire world. (i.e. no. You get to be a werewolf until you die, choose not to be, or the event ends.)

[16:24] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <Scorpius5> Are there any plans to make all of the maps available at every level? Like create different level range brackets for each map so once you're high enough level to access a Hero Games map you will always have access to that map?

[16:25] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Yes!

[16:25] <@Cryptic_Lucid> The playerbase has made it clear that this is something they would like, so it's a feature we're looking to add. We haven't worked out the specifics yet. Our primary concern is splitting the player base, especially as we continue to add new maps; if there are too many queues to choose from, there won't be enough players for a full game on any given map.

[16:25] <@Cryptic_Lucid> So, I don't have specifics for you yet, but we definitely want something like this.

[16:25] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Because you want something like this.

[16:26] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <Valentine> What are the plans for allowing pre-set teams to fight each other?

[16:26] <@Cryptic_Lucid> When Blood Moon goes live, you'll see faction-based open-world PvP. Two teams can join up on opposite sides and fight it out in the real world.

[16:27] <@Cryptic_Lucid> We're also investigating supergroup vs. supergroup feuds, where members of rival supergroups can engage in open-world PvP. This would let you duel with members of another supergroup in the middle of Millennium City!

[16:27] <@Cryptic_Lucid> We probably won't allow pre-set teams to fight each other in the Hero Games because it's too easy to exploit for rewards. If there's still a lot of call for this once Champions has open-world PvP, we can look into other options.

[16:27] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Maybe a room in the PowerHouse or something?

[16:27] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <Mighty_Pencil> Many people have expressed concerns of OP in passive powers during PVP, how does the team intend to address this issue?

[16:28] <@Chronomancer> We know that there are issues with the offensive passives, and are doing a pass on these next. Previously we would probably have addressed these already, but we're consciously slowing down our pace to get things right while simultaneously not nerfing.

[16:29] <@Chronomancer> Right now if things are a little too good, we're just letting it go while we focus on making the things that are underpowered better.

[16:30] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Q: There are currently a lot of issues with the two most commonly played game types, BASH'es issue being exploitable by joining as a team or "tagging" kills with AoE's and UTC's issue being the pug vs premade, What can the devs tell us if there will be any future solutions to these issues?

[16:30] <@Cryptic_Lucid> (Sorry, I failed to copy your name, noble querant.)

[16:30] <@Cryptic_Lucid> A: Yup. We're aware of both of these issues, and we definitely want to solve 'em.

[16:30] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Separating PUGs and premade groups is in the works--we think this is a good idea, too. When specifically it goes in is a matter of scheduling, but it's definitely on the to-do list.

[16:31] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Kill credit is a trickier issue, because there are always edge cases--in games where only the last blow counts, for instance, you have kill-stealers who swoop in at the last minute to take the credit. Hopefully we can eliminate some of the worst exploits (like sharing credit on a team) in Champions without introducing any new ones.

[16:31] <~COquestionbot> <WebGuest20> How does the living side *win* zombie apoc? Time limit? Destroy some other widget?

[16:32] <@Cryptic_Lucid> What part of "Zombie Apocalypse" sounds winnable to you?

[16:32] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Okay, yes, there is a win condition. If the heroes survive for a long time (15 minutes, I think), the game ends as a victory (fictionally, the rescue helicopters finally arrive).

[16:32] <@Cryptic_Lucid> But the number of NPC zombies gradually increases as the game progresses, and each dead hero means another superpowered Zombie. In practice, it's usually just a matter of time.

[16:32] <~COquestionbot> <Angelight> Even if it is dumb, I'll ask it anyway. During Blood Moon, will there be a zombie mission at Mercy Hospital? Since it'd be a funny call out to Left 4 Dead since you go through Mercy Hospital. Sorry for the silly question out of all the serious ones.

[16:32] <@cryptic_robobo> It would be A great nod to a cool game but alas we don't have a Mercy mission

[16:33] <~Cryptic_Daeke> Remember, today's topic is PvP. If you have a question to ask, head over to #COquestions and ask it in chat.

[16:33] <~COquestionbot> <Gouitsu> I have an issue when playng with a pad in pvp arena where when the countdown finishes my game doesnt detect and pad input unless I go trough the door using the keyboard first

[16:34] <@Chronomancer> We don't fully support the game pad at the moment, but our work on the 360 version is getting us LOTS of improvements on the PC side. For example, we can now go through the entire tutorial with just the controller.

[16:34] <@Chronomancer> As soon as we get our full support worked out, we're going to make a big deal out of it because the game really is fun with a controller! And I'll also pass along your bug to the programmers - thanks for catching it.

[16:34] <~COquestionbot> <Discord> Any ideas on how to better reward support characters in PvP?

[16:34] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Yes.

[16:34] <@Cryptic_Lucid> In the long term, it'd be great to implement some of the systems that players have suggested: give healers credit for kills made by the players they heal, for instance. This is long term stuff.

[16:35] <@Cryptic_Lucid> In the short term, we're making a point to roll out maps that reward healers. ZombApoc is a great example of this: Heros get points for surviving, which usually involves working as a group. Healers get exactly the same points as DPS.

[16:35] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Codorna: Question: Are random drops working as intended? it is very common to see epics that are worse than blues or even greens of the same level

[16:36] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> *Most* Are. Some "weak" items are too strong, and are making our strong items look too weak... and a few vice versa. Here's the issue: We don't want to reduce the potency of any items that have already dropped / are being used, and we don't want to cause random inflation in the game's balance... I promise that would cause more problems than it solves!

[16:36] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Our current plan is to really be careful going forward, making sure that new items in new content (and as we raise the level cap) are at EXACTLY the right power level, let the problem fix itself over time. Naturally, anything that's twice or half as good as it should be will be fixed... but stuff that's closer to correct that that we'll be leaving alone.

[16:36] <~COquestionbot> <TheVedis> Can anything be done about the situation with stalemates? Currently many games are going to stalemate due to the people who are losing exiting the games in UTC and BASH and leaving no opponents.

[16:36] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Right now, if you stick out a PvP game when you're losing, you get a fair chunk of XP, Acclaim, and credit toward perks. If you bail, you get nothing at all, except a big raspberry from me personally.

[16:36] <@Cryptic_Lucid> The stronger solution is to make the game end instantly when one team is empty. This is in the works for the very near future.

[16:37] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <Mr. Funsocks> When are groups going to be automatic upon entering a PvP map?

[16:37] <@cryptic_robobo> Auto teaming for pvp is on the list of things to do to. We will get it in as soon as we can.

[16:38] <~COquestionbot> <Fabled> Question: Time travel PvP scenario: one side can play the minions of Dr. Destroyer while the other side players the side of the Champions heroes during the time before the destruction of detroit (old millenium city). Do you think we can see something like that and with buildings/structure that can be destroyed ?

[16:38] <@Chronomancer> We're looking at a lot of different scenraio types for PvP since this is really what seems to resonate with players. Time Travel scenarios are very cool... hmmm... sounds like something we should do on a larger scale perhaps...

[16:38] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Pixelated_Doom Question: Will we ever see elemental melee based power sets?

[16:38] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Yes.

[16:38] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Done. =)

[16:39] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> No, seriously... look for the items that give you flaming fists and stuff. They'll tide you over.

[16:39] <@Chronomancer> Power replaces rock.

[16:41] <~COquestionbot> <TheVedis> Question: Hold resistance does not seem to work at all in pvp. Players are still getting the full effect of holds regardless of resistance, and are even chaining holds so that you become stuck in them until you are dead, is anything being done about this?

[16:41] <@Chronomancer> We made a pass on these and weren't aware this was still happening. We'll get to testing that internally and see if it's still hapenning and address it. The intention is not to allow characters to be chain held in PvP.

[16:42] <~COquestionbot> <Maelstrom> Are there any plans for... "special maps?" Like a map that's underwater and forces you to swim around?

[16:42] <@cryptic_robobo> The pvp community has made it clear that they want more scenario maps. Going forward we intend to create as many scenario maps that offer different types of gameplay in various locations. An undewater BASH would be a cool addition!

[16:42] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <DarthVeer> A Dev mentioned in one of threads about a Hero Games Ranking system, can you tell us a little more about what you have planned for this, and what kind of rewards we can possibly expect to see when it is implemented?

[16:43] <@Cryptic_Lucid> Right now, the ranking system is a gleam in our eye. We want it, players want it, so it's going to happen, but I can't give you specifics because there aren't any yet.

[16:43] <@Cryptic_Lucid> This will be a pretty major change and we want to get it right.

[16:43] <@Cryptic_Lucid> The rewards will be cool.

[16:44] <~COquestionbot> <ProfessorWalsh> Question: This one is important to PVP but concerns Personal Force Field. Are there any plans to change PFF so that it doesn't set to 0 after restoring so that PFF users don't have to wait to re-enter the arena so they can be like every other passive defense user?

[16:44] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Unlikely; the same thing that would make it do that would make it refresh to full if you took it out of its slot and reslotted it... a rather severe exploit, I'm sure you'll agree. =) BUT.. I have some other things in internal test that should make it MUCH better, and help compensate for its lack of block interaction.

[16:45] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> Basically, I'm experimenting with having Defense and Power boosts give it a substantial recharge.

[16:45] <~Cryptic_Daeke> <ProfessorWalsh> Question: Are there any plans to inject new types of Hero Games into the game? Such as CTF and Dueling tournaments? (being as the hero games are supposed to be a reality gameshow)

[16:45] <@cryptic_robobo> Capture the Flag and King of the Hill are two game types that we want to get in the game as soon as we can.

[16:46] <~Cryptic_Daeke> See, the problem stems from the fact that I already AM the King of the Hill.

[16:46] <~Cryptic_Daeke> So the gametype would be kind of boring for everyone else.

[16:47] <~COquestionbot> <Discord> The potentially currently exists for making macros/scripts that mash the BREAK key faster then humanly possible, breaking free of holds/roots alot quicker then you rightfully should. Has any discussed maybe adding a limit on how often the button can be pressed. Maybe half a second between registered clicks?

[16:47] <@Chronomancer> This isn't possible, actually. The "break hold" command already only recognized every 1/2 second, which is easily slower than I can mash a button. Of course, I was raised on arcade games and Diablo.

[16:47] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> brief word about holds... holds that need to be charged get stronger based on how long they were charged for. Holds that are instantly applied are weakened based on how much energy your target has; you want to hit enemies that go empty.

[16:47] <@Cryptic_Balseraph> So, watch your opponents energy level, and time your hold appropriately.

[16:49] <~Cryptic_Daeke> Alrighty, with that, we're done!

[16:49] <~Cryptic_Daeke> Thank you all for coming!

[16:50] <@Chronomancer> <TheVedis> So no answer about people being turned into chickens for abandoning matches?

[16:51] <@Chronomancer> I think we'd have to be able to know if you quit rather than were legitimate drops or disconnects, but I do love that idea.