Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

Solid Evidence for Big Bang...ON FOX NEWS?Follow

#1 Mar 16 2006 at 5:04 PM Rating: Decent
I read the news of "the enemy" daily, to keep up with the "talking points" of the day and for a good laugh. Today, I stumbled upon this shockaroo:

Astrophysicists Find Solid Evidence for Big Bang Inflation

Quote:
Physicists announced Thursday that they now have the smoking gun that shows the universe went through extremely rapid expansion in the moments after the big bang, growing from the size of a marble to a volume larger than all of observable space in less than a trillion-trillionth of a second.


Now if only they could do a story on Him
____________________________
"The Rich are there to take all of the money & pay none of the taxes, the middle class is there to do all the work and pay all the taxes, and the poor are there to scare the crap out of the middle class." -George Carlin


#2 Mar 16 2006 at 5:07 PM Rating: Decent
*****
10,755 posts
Your a moran.
#3 Mar 16 2006 at 5:11 PM Rating: Decent
***
3,101 posts
NephthysWanderer the Charming wrote:
Your a moran.


Misspelled for humor?
#4 Mar 16 2006 at 5:12 PM Rating: Good
fenderputy the Shady wrote:
NephthysWanderer the Charming wrote:
Your a moran.


Misspelled for humor?
Smiley: oyvey
#5 Mar 16 2006 at 5:17 PM Rating: Decent
*****
10,755 posts
Oh I did misspell those didn't I?

How ironic.
#6 Mar 16 2006 at 5:20 PM Rating: Decent
***
3,101 posts
I figured you had misspelled "your" for humor. I just didn't find it to be humorous.
#7 Mar 16 2006 at 5:26 PM Rating: Decent
*****
10,755 posts
Quote:
I figured you had misspelled "your" for humor. I just didn't find it to be humorous.


I'm not surprised. Your a moran to.
#8 Mar 16 2006 at 5:26 PM Rating: Decent
***
3,101 posts
As far as the topic is concerned, I thought the "Big Bang" had already been proven to the point of the Catholic Church acknowledging its plausibility?
#9 Mar 16 2006 at 5:35 PM Rating: Decent
Imaginary Friend
*****
16,112 posts
Quote:
Now if only they could do a story on Him


Spagetti is genderless

unless it chooses not to be..
____________________________
With the receiver in my hand..
#10 Mar 16 2006 at 5:40 PM Rating: Good
*****
18,463 posts
fenderputy the Shady wrote:
As far as the topic is concerned, I thought the "Big Bang" had already been proven to the point of the Catholic Church acknowledging its plausibility?

I thought a Theory is by definiton unable to be proven. If it was proven, wouldn't it be a Law?
#11 Mar 16 2006 at 6:03 PM Rating: Decent
***
3,101 posts
The Glorious Atomicflea wrote:
fenderputy the Shady wrote:
As far as the topic is concerned, I thought the "Big Bang" had already been proven to the point of the Catholic Church acknowledging its plausibility?

I thought a Theory is by definiton unable to be proven. If it was proven, wouldn't it be a Law?


Yeah, you're right. It was a poor choice of words on my part. However, I am still pretty sure the Catholic Church has accepted this theory as plausible, and that they did so some time ago. They still attribute everything previous to the big bang to the man upstairs but, a rather progressive step none the less. If a church can do it, a broadcasting station can.
#12 Mar 16 2006 at 7:29 PM Rating: Decent
The Glorious Atomicflea wrote:
fenderputy the Shady wrote:
As far as the topic is concerned, I thought the "Big Bang" had already been proven to the point of the Catholic Church acknowledging its plausibility?

I thought a Theory is by definiton unable to be proven. If it was proven, wouldn't it be a Law?


There is no such thing as scientific proof. Only a preponderance of scientific evidence.

A law is just a theory with loads of evidence behind it. In science nothing can be proven correct, only proven wrong (by finding results to the contrary).

In reality, most laws - Newton's Laws, Kepler's Laws, the ideal gas law - are all only valid within certain limits. Newton's laws, for example, and quite good for sizable particles (stuff observable with the visible spectra of light (even under a high powered visible light microscope)) if these particles aren't going too fast (near the speed of light). By contrast, the ideal gas "law" sucks ***. In principle, it is true for totally non-interacting particles - but find me a truely totally non-interacting particle, and I've got a bridge to sell you*. (Even Helium, the sort of "most ideal-esque" gas doesn't even come close to following the ideal gas law over a sizable range of temperatures and pressures). The van der Waal equation is vastly superior - but it is not a "law".

In practice, people used to name things laws and around 1900 or the late 1800's simply stopped. Maxwell's equations are not called "laws" (at least not all four of them - some have other names). Eintein's theories of relativity - just called theories even though they actually *reduce to Newton's laws* at low velocity (and thus are more accurate).


The "best" law (or theory) is simply known as quantum electrodynamics, and is not routinely referred to as either a law or a theory.

As far as I know, the most accurate measurement (e.g. most significant digits) in history is this "g" factor which has to do with the magnetic moment and angular momentum of an electron (in practice, g is a number quite close to the integer, 2). This measurement is consistent with quantum electrodynamics to some huge number of significant digits (something like 12, as I recall, vastly more then virtually any other quantity such as the mass or charge of an electron or proton has ever been measured).

In conclusion, right now the designations of "law" or "thoery" or "model" in science don't necessairly correlate with (decresing) certainty. If you want absolute certainty, go find some mathematical thoerms. Lastly (again) there is no such thing as scientific "truth". There are only well regarded "theories". They are all approximations - the better ones we know their limits.
___
* Note: it is a simple and enlightening exercise to derive the ideal gas law from basic thermal physics (the equipartition of energy)
#13 Mar 16 2006 at 7:40 PM Rating: Decent
fenderputy the Shady wrote:
As far as the topic is concerned, I thought the "Big Bang" had already been proven to the point of the Catholic Church acknowledging its plausibility?


Big bang is pretty well accepted. This article is about *inflation* which is a special feature not expected in "standard" big bang models. My impression is that cosmologists (astrophysicsts who deal with the beginning and end of the universe) find subtle evidence that the big bang wasn't a totally "smooth and regular" explosion (of space and time as well as matter within that space and time) and that at this particular moment, things went really, really fast (inflated).

In some sense, inflation is an argument that we don't know everything about the big bang - and so it's casting doubt on it. I don't know - they may have a great "handle" on inflation now - that is to say: maybe in retrospect if we knew the physics we know now back in the 1970's or 80's or whenever this issue arose it would not have ever been seen as a problem with the big bang, but confirmation.

The beginnings and ending of the universe are never going to be really well known since they cannot be reproduced in the lab (well, hopefully not anyhow!). This is in contrast to most of the laws of physics which can be tested in the lab.
#14 Mar 16 2006 at 8:34 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
****
5,677 posts
I thought the Big Bang theory was not really about the actual bang at all, but more the aftereffects of the bang. Inflation theory picks up where Big Bang leaves off (going backwards in time).

In other words, the Big Bang theory accounts nicely for the expansion of the observable Universe both now and going back in time, but only back until shortly after the "explosion." Inflation theory then accounts for what was going on "near the beginning," both in terms of a rough sketch of the universe's structure (of incomprehensibly small size) and also the properties and processes of the super-rapid expansion.

As a side note, I find it interesting that some have theorized that because the known universe was at one point condensed into such a small size (or at least the precursers were), and everthing was all smashed up together, everything was (or became) causally connected.

After inflation and the continued expansion of the known universe, you can't help but think that perhaps the fundamental elements are still causally connected despite the vast distances that can separate them. Of course I'm getting at the whole "spooky action at a distance" sort of thing here...
#15 Mar 16 2006 at 10:24 PM Rating: Excellent
Liberal Conspiracy
*******
TILT
yossarian wrote:
In conclusion, right now the designations of "law" or "thoery" or "model" in science don't necessairly correlate with (decresing) certainty.
My understanding as well, at least from scientific terms, is that a "Theory" (capital 't') is a framework which attempts to describe a macroevent whereas a Law attempts to define a single idea. So you have Laws of Thermodynamics or Laws of Motion but a Theory of Evolution or the Big Bang Theory. The Big Bang Theory encompasses most of what we know about the cosmos, motion, inertia and a bunch of other scientific phenomena and tries to string it all together into one plausible explanation for why an event occured.
____________________________
Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 162 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (162)