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#27 Oct 12 2004 at 11:46 AM Rating: Good
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It came up at some point that SMN have a way they can blink someone other than themselves. What exactly is that? Is it AOE, or just a 1-person-at-a-time deal


Garuda is able to group-blink when the SMN reached lvl 25 (it's a blood pact ability). From what I have read, this is actually counter productive when you 'group-blink' you NIN tank because one of the shadows will actually absorb the blink, thus eliminating one of the shadows. It is very useful for the rest of the party otherwise. Problem with it being a PLD's best friend is 1)it cost the SMN 96MP to cast this Blood pact and 2)Blood pact's have 1 min recast time so you can only cast it at the most once per fight at best.
#28 Oct 12 2004 at 11:51 AM Rating: Decent
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There are no "bots" for claiming. Some people use game pads with turbo options that have the ability to spam Provoke continiously. Gil farmers prolly have 1 guy controlling multiple characters to spam Turbo-voke 24-7 at the spawn site


I just wanted to add, that this as far as I know is not true. I have a rather limited knowledge of current scripting in FFXI since its absolutely disgusting, but basically..

I believe NM camping bots works by having the script recognize the memory location of "Insert NM name here". So basically it will use the tab function around the room until it recognizes the memory location of the NM ("Argus" or "Valkurm Emporer" for example), and will then Provoke as usual.

Of course, I'm sure these types are a bit rarer, scripts that endlessly mash Provoke are probably a bit more common.
#29 Oct 12 2004 at 11:58 AM Rating: Decent
Vimien wrote:
Garuda is able to group-blink when the SMN reached lvl 25 (it's a blood pact ability). From what I have read, this is actually counter productive when you 'group-blink' you NIN tank because one of the shadows will actually absorb the blink, thus eliminating one of the shadows. It is very useful for the rest of the party otherwise. Problem with it being a PLD's best friend is 1)it cost the SMN 96MP to cast this Blood pact and 2)Blood pact's have 1 min recast time so you can only cast it at the most once per fight at best.


In your opinion then, would using Garuda's group blink be a viable option to withstand the Flood spell of the BCNM40 black mandy in a pt which has a pally for tank rather than a nin?

I just get disappointed when ppl tell me that a particular job can't be used in some thing or another due to 'x' reason. Such as Flood in this fight.

I'm miles away from doing any BCNM40, but I'm looking for a work-around. =P
#30 Oct 12 2004 at 11:59 AM Rating: Decent
Germonick the Shady wrote:
Of course, I'm sure these types are a bit rarer, scripts that endlessly mash Provoke are probably a bit more common.


In my experience this tends to be the case. Which means it's possible to beat the bots out if their voke spamming has landed them a normal mob when the NM pops.
#31 Oct 12 2004 at 12:12 PM Rating: Decent
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There are no "bots" for claiming.


Their are indeed bots for claiming mobs. One day you should go camp Stroper Chyme. You'll notice an interesting thing, the team of gilfarmers don't clear out the bats and beetles that spawn on the stairs. But sure enough, once Stroper Chyme pops, it's claimed, and every other mob around it is untouched.

Sadly though, S-E will do nothing about this, and their really isn't a damn thing we can do about it. ; ;
#32 Oct 12 2004 at 12:14 PM Rating: Good
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996 posts
Vimien wrote:
Garuda is able to group-blink when the SMN reached lvl 25 (it's a blood pact ability). From what I have read, this is actually counter productive when you 'group-blink' you NIN tank because one of the shadows will actually absorb the blink, thus eliminating one of the shadows.
This is not true. I was in a party with a SMN in Garlaige the other night and I was using Utsusemi. When Aerial Armor is cast, it Has No Effect on me. My shadows remain.

The thing about Blink (WHM) and Aerial Armor is that they're not guaranteed to work. There's a chance that the mob could miss a shadow and still hit you, whereas Utsusemi is guaranteed to work (in situations where a Blink shadow would actually *take* the hit, of course).

I didn't see an answer to this one, so I'll take it:
Nataraja wrote:
Here's a related question. Once leeching stat effects like Poison, Dia, etc. actually land, do your stats play any roll in how fast the leeching effect drains you, and how long it lasts? If so, which ones?
Yes, and it depends on what the effect is.

First off, I believe resistance will be modified by any elemental alignments you have. For example, if you have Barwater on, and Poison does land, I believe it does still affect the wear time.

Now, elements aside, I believe VIT does affect your drain rate on physical DOT effects (poison), while MND affects drain rate on magical DOT effects. Stuff like Dia and Bio, however, have fixed drain rates, as far as I can tell, so all the MND in the world won't change how much they untick your HP. I think it does affect stuff like Rasp, Frost, Choke, etc.

I know that I've played different classes and I've been hit with Poison by the same mob that sometimes would drain 1 HP per tick, and sometimes 3, depending on my class (3 for Warrior, 1 for THF with high VIT equipment at that time). Thus, I believe Poison is affected by VIT directly (since it is a physical ailment).

Accordingly, I'm guessing that resistance (initial and DOT) to Foe Requiem is dictated by CHR. That's just an educated guess on my part, though.

Edited, Tue Oct 12 13:22:44 2004 by Cutriss
#33 Oct 12 2004 at 12:17 PM Rating: Decent
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935 posts
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Sadly though, S-E will do nothing about this, and their really isn't a damn thing we can do about it. ; ;


This isn't really true. Common Scripting is really the fault of DirectX to the best of my knowledge. Certain loop files are easy to exploit. It's easy to say SE isn't doing anything, but its tougher to come up with real solutions to a problem that many MMO's face simply due to the nature of programming.
#34 Oct 12 2004 at 12:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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642 posts




You dont see 64 status bars strewn across your screen. You can party and alliance and those would be the only names you see, just like normal.


Edited, Thu Apr 21 13:25:39 2005 by Eleusynia
#35 Oct 12 2004 at 12:27 PM Rating: Good
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363 posts
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Vimien wrote:
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Garuda is able to group-blink when the SMN reached lvl 25 (it's a blood pact ability). From what I have read, this is actually counter productive when you 'group-blink' you NIN tank because one of the shadows will actually absorb the blink, thus eliminating one of the shadows.
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This is not true. I was in a party with a SMN in Garlaige the other night and I was using Utsusemi. When Aerial Armor is cast, it Has No Effect on me. My shadows remain.

The thing about Blink (WHM) and Aerial Armor is that they're not guaranteed to work. There's a chance that the mob could miss a shadow and still hit you, whereas Utsusemi is guaranteed to work (in situations where a Blink shadow would actually *take* the hit, of course).


Thanks for clarifying this Cutriss. rate up!

Quote:
In your opinion then, would using Garuda's group blink be a viable option to withstand the Flood spell of the BCNM40 black mandy in a pt which has a pally for tank rather than a nin?

I just get disappointed when ppl tell me that a particular job can't be used in some thing or another due to 'x' reason. Such as Flood in this fight.

I'm miles away from doing any BCNM40, but I'm looking for a work-around. =P


yes technically you could do the blink thing and have flood absorbed by your blink but as far as practicality, it's near impossible that would work (you have 7 other mandy's beating up on you so your blink is bound to wear off before hand). Also a SMN would be best off in one of those fights to use a 2hr Astral Flow IMO. I guess the trick with the mandy's is everyone bring poison potions since poison potions will protect you against being slept during the fight which means he won't be able to cast flood on you while your takin' a nap. A DRK in this case can easily stun the Mandy before he casts it. PLD shield bash also works.

#36 Oct 12 2004 at 12:47 PM Rating: Good
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425 posts
Ok, so I have to take THF to 37, eh? Ok then, here's my question:

What should I use as a subjob on THF?
#37 Oct 12 2004 at 1:03 PM Rating: Decent
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292 posts
Until level 30 you should either sub Warrior or Monk, depending on what weapon you want to use (sword or hand-to-hand.) The reason for this is because pre-33 dagger weapon skills are pretty crappy, and you will get much more out of stacking sneak attack with Fast Blade or Combo.

When you hit 30 it's Ninja all the way.

Also be sure to keep Dagger leveled, it becomes your hands down best weapon at 33.
#38 Oct 12 2004 at 1:32 PM Rating: Decent
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996 posts
GOD NO DON'T USE MONK IF YOU CAN HELP IT.

I *hated* THF after taking it all the way to 30 with MNK. It was so hard to get parties, and I didn't do a lot of damage even with SA. H2H almost never did any appreciable damage. I've *seen* it do damage, sure, but not enough to warrant picking MNK instead of NIN. Boost will slow your attack rate down to something slower than a sword, making your low-damage dagger even more useless.

With NIN, it might take you until 20 to get Dual Wield going, but once you do, you won't look back. Wanna level two weapon skills at once? Put a sword in your off hand (Small Sword preferably, DEX+2) and there ya go. NIN also gives you better accompanying stats (AGI and DEX) than MNK does. As a THF, you won't do enough damage to get more than two hits on you in a battle, so the MNK's boosted VIT is wasted on you, as is Counter. NIN's Utsusemi will take care of those two hits without a second glance.

I cursed myself repeatedly for playing a THF until I hit 30 because I picked the wrong subjob to raise it with. I should have used WAR (since I didn't have the luxury of a 30+ job to unlock NIN). Now that I have NIN, THF is a **wonderful* class to play.

Edited, Tue Oct 12 14:34:58 2004 by Cutriss
#39 Oct 12 2004 at 1:40 PM Rating: Decent
Vimien wrote:
yes technically you could do the blink thing and have flood absorbed by your blink but as far as practicality, it's near impossible that would work (you have 7 other mandy's beating up on you so your blink is bound to wear off before hand). Also a SMN would be best off in one of those fights to use a 2hr Astral Flow IMO. I guess the trick with the mandy's is everyone bring poison potions since poison potions will protect you against being slept during the fight which means he won't be able to cast flood on you while your takin' a nap. A DRK in this case can easily stun the Mandy before he casts it. PLD shield bash also works.


As far as the other mandies go, it would seem to me that a good strategy would be to bring a BRD along to sleep the other buggers. Negating the issue with all the mandies pummeling you at once.

I'm thinking of the blink idea more as a last line of defense for a PLD tank than the only defense. I just know that I've seen Stunning attacks used a hair too late, and not interupting a casting before. It would be nice to have a little more breathing room.

Related question. If someone is poisoned, and then has blink cast on them (whatever version, utsusemi included), the unticks don't negate the shadows do they? My common sense tells me that this would not be the case, but then common sense also tells me that a gob should not be able to smack me with his sword from 200 yards away... >.>

[Edit: Clarity nata, clarity. >< ]

Edited, Tue Oct 12 14:43:52 2004 by nataraja
#40 Oct 12 2004 at 1:46 PM Rating: Decent
Thanks for the Dynamis info Ele.

Lol in defense of my own intelligence though I know the 64 ppl aren't just random ppl who strolled in there. =P I was wondering more if your 64 ppl would be the only 64 ppl you would see (similar to the way BCNM work).

You answered my question nevertheless. Thanks!
#41 Oct 12 2004 at 2:26 PM Rating: Decent
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215 posts
As a WHM / SMN I have to say this about Blink and Garuda. On a White Mage, he or she can cast Blink AND gain the effect of blink from Garuda. On a NIN, the Blink effect simply has no effect. The shadows absorb only attacks or detremental spells that are being cast on it. Also, in Promyvion, the AOE from the Memory Recepticles takes away 2 shadows instead of 1. This makes Ninja's very practical in these events. After 4 failed attempts though (Damn that guy at the end of Holla is hard), Promyvion is getting very expensive. I sure hope it's worth it!

But I digress, in physical combat, blink and aerial armor seem to have a noticable rate of being ignored. This is mostly the case when fighting mobs that are well above the casters current level (as mages are prone to be in areas such as this), or randomly on XP mobs. Blink and Aerial Armor have very little noticable difference, if at all. However, Utsu ichi and ni are both very good at absorbing hits. I think that this reflects the job. NIN is made to fight while mages are meant to hide. A NIN will sometimes request Aerial Armor at the beginning of a chain to save them a few Shihei. I feel sorry for them having to burn through those things like that!

Generally the SMN main will cast aerial armor as much as they can. But it falls to Earthen Ward (Area Effect Stone Skin), and Hastega (you know, Haste...ga (AOE Haste), that the Summoner will generally cast. As a WHM/SMN, I cast Aerial Armor when I can; usually at the start of a chain. But I would kill for Earthen Ward and/or Hastega. Oh god it would be so nice. It's for these two effects that I want to level SMN. I just need to finish up with Ramuh and Leviathan!

As far as Blink Tanks are concerned. In my experience (all the way up to level 60), i've prefered NIN's and War/NIN to PLD simply for the fact that it is easier to get them out of trouble (I.E. Flash), and easier to keep them cured (Because they do not get hit until their blink is gone). Paladins are nice because they have so much hate, but after WHM gets their AF and a peace ring/Enmity Cape, it becomes the fun of the WHM to basically do whatever they want, within reason of course.

I've helped a friend get NIN from 12-25 or so and got to see a lot of the fun they can have. I've also helped that same friend try and tank as a WAR/NIN on crabs in Boyada Tree and laughed as he got knocked down to about 10-5hp repeatedly. Crazy fool! People seem to have a beef with the NIN and i'd love to know why. In my experience NIN has been far more lucrative XP wise for me than PLD. My dumb question is why do you think this is?
#42 Oct 12 2004 at 2:36 PM Rating: Decent
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83 posts
Does anyone have the link with the pictures of the full AF and AF2(relic) gear? I remember seeing a link for it on here somewhere but can't find it.
#43 Oct 12 2004 at 2:41 PM Rating: Decent
Lol my oldest friend in the game is a Ninja, and I'm a Paladin, so we've had this fight out several times.

At the end I honestly think they're about equal. It just depends on the situation, though either is typically a viable option with the right strategies.

I'm interested to know who you hear ragging on NIN all the time though. All I ever here is NIN NIN NIN, oh you're a paladin? go away, NIN NIN NIN. =P
#44 Oct 12 2004 at 2:54 PM Rating: Decent
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790 posts
Pics of all AF2s from a JPN site:

http://www.geocities.co.jp/SiliconValley-Bay/2740/ff_kihon_af2.html

DRK AF2 looks like crap. RDM AF2 looks wierd. DRG and PLD AF2 looks great. WHM AF2 have almost no change.
#45 Oct 12 2004 at 2:56 PM Rating: Good
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425 posts
Thanks for the info Kamakaze and Valcrist. My only problem would be that I don't have NIN and therefore...blah. I might just sub WAR on THF until 37 because I don't feel like lvl NIN, especially since I was going to do the quest for Uteshimimoto-(whatever the hell that NIN blink spell is) because it goes for a lot of bread. I was planning on doing the NIN scroll quests to simply sell the scrolls, because ole Xano needs to get his grubby Elvaan hands on his first Sniper's Ring.

Maybe it's time for me to start selling my body on the streets of Jeuno. ~.^

Edited, Tue Oct 12 16:02:45 2004 by Xanoxonax
#46 Oct 12 2004 at 2:57 PM Rating: Decent
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HNM Linkshells are formed for higher level players to participate in higher level events with other players of their level, such as Dynamis and HNM hunts. Dynamis is basically a very difficult BCNM battle, requiring full alliances and fighting more than one mob, typically several at one time.

Specifically, HNM (Hyper Notorious Monsters) LSes only allow in people that are over level 65 in their chosen job, and only after seeing how said person plays. For almost all HNMs you must be over level 65 to have a chance at winning.

As for what an HNM is:

A HNM is typically a tougher spawn of a NM. For example, King Behemoth is the HNM of Behemoth, as Nidhogg is the HNM of Fafnir. HNM LSes will go about their day as normal in-game, but when they hear about a HNM popping, it's a mad dash to that place, as they'll already be having a RNG/NIN or NIN kiting the thing all over the place, keeping it claimed. (Assuming they got the claim.) Another type of HNM are the Gods. There are 5 I know of, as I haven't read anything about any new Gods in CoP, and they are: Genbu, Suzaku, Seiryu, Byakko, and Kirin. Genbu is by far the easiest (he hits like an old lady once you Arctic Wind his ***), and Kirin is the master of the other Gods, spawning a slightly less-tough version of each during the process of the 2-3 hour battle. Order of the Blue Gartr did Kirin for the first time with 26 people, switching them in and out of the alliance as needed.

Dynamis is an alternate dimension where you can find pieces of AF2 (Relic) and things for Cursed armor sets. Typically it's done just to get the drops and say you've done it (find someone that has "Dynamis-Xarcabard Interloper" as their title and gawk at them, they're as uber as you get in the game), though some people do them for fun. Dynamis is considered (for now) the hardest thing in the game, barring anything that has been released in CoP.
#47 Oct 12 2004 at 2:59 PM Rating: Decent
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935 posts
Quote:
I'm interested to know who you hear ragging on NIN all the time though. All I ever here is NIN NIN NIN, oh you're a paladin? go away, NIN NIN NIN. =P


I think on the Allakhazam forums NINs take quite a bit of heat, especially for "not being able to control hate", which in my experiences levelling NIN to 60 have been absolutely untrue. Of course, in game I've only had a couple bad examples come up. I've run into a couple of WHMs who won't party with NINs for some reason, but adversely I've noticed many RNGs, especially past 55 seem to enjoy partying with NIN.

I highly doubt anyone tells a PLD to go away though :P Tanks are tanks and will always be loved. Furthermore, PLDs need to feel no insecurity from NINs since they both have their place in the endgame, and PLDs debatedly have the larger spot there.

EDIT: I think a lot of the reason people are reluctant to take NINs is becuase it is a job that is incredibly affected by your gil supply. This is not to say that being rich will make you a good NIN, but not having money for the vast amount of NIN consumables you use can and will make you a poor NIN. Furthermore, I think NIN is a job that really gets away with being played cheaply 1-37. Some jobs level it as a subjob, and use the arguement that since it's just a sujob, equipment/consumables aren't as important to use. A flawed arguement certainly, but nonetheless I've seen it multiple times. I spend approx 100-140k every fours exping on NIN, but I do my best to use shurikens, proper Ninjutsu, and good food. So it's a job that takes a lot, and I really think you need to have a good concept of tanking and hate control in general to succeed as a NIN.



Edited, Tue Oct 12 16:05:35 2004 by Germonick
#48 Oct 12 2004 at 3:00 PM Rating: Decent
I like the style of the SMN AF2.

I kinda think the NIN looks crappy though.

Gotta love that PLD and DRG though. ^^
#49 Oct 12 2004 at 3:04 PM Rating: Decent
Germonick the Shady wrote:
I think on the Allakhazam forums NINs take quite a bit of heat, especially for "not being able to control hate", which in my experiences levelling NIN to 60 have been absolutely untrue. Of course, in game I've only had a couple bad examples come up. I've run into a couple of WHMs who won't party with NINs for some reason, but adversely I've noticed many RNGs, especially past 55 seem to enjoy partying with NIN.

I highly doubt anyone tells a PLD to go away though :P Tanks are tanks and will always be loved. Furthermore, PLDs need to feel no insecurity from NINs since they both have their place in the endgame, and PLDs debatedly have the larger spot there.


lol i've seen a lot of ppl get dismissive in conversation. Haven't gotten my PLD up high enough to pt yet, but I doubt I'll have any problems there. A tank is a tank, as you say.

A NIN can control hate just fine, between the added boost of WHM casting less cures and all those various tools they have. It just requires somewhat of a more mindful player imo. A pally's got hate control easy.

You wanna talk hard hate control. Try controlling hate in a pt of mostly mages as a War/Thf in Yhoator. Gah! Such was my 26-27 experience =P
#50 Oct 12 2004 at 3:05 PM Rating: Decent
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282 posts


HNM= Hyper Notorious Monster

Usually some people described monster that requires more than one parties and drop valuable loots HNM. But when you get to high levels and can basicly solo and duo those monster, it ceased to be HNM. Though no one will ignore a serket if it popped, its no longer hyper to certain people. For these people therefore, the real HNM is the top tier HNM. My example is the top 3 King HNM, the harder pop of a normal HNM that have better drop chances for rarer loots.

Nidhogg is a king pop of Fafnir (which by himself is hard as hell, example: Averyl kept it for several hours and his health winds up being more than what it was before they wiped. Averyl is not a weak linkshell mind you)

Aspidochelone is the King pop of Adamantoise

King Behemoth is the king pop of behemoth

Kirin and his ***** gods are pop monster that require several steps to farm and obtain items to pop them. They are generally considered HNM also.

So in conclusion, Hyper notorious monsters are general name for all monster that is harder than the average NM, drop good loots and requires a strategy and cooperation amongst several players. For some Steelfleeced will always be HNM while for a some that can solo it, its not.

As for Dynamis, its not basically BcNM. Dynamis's experience is very general for most player with no strategy except, DO what the organizer tell you. The organizers themselves dished out 1 million for that initial hour glass, they decide who to place in parties, the path to take, mob to pull. The rest follows order to the T to ensured no wipe out. The general strategy usually are never fully explained to first timer, just do what ever we tell you. Lotting rights are also determined by organizers.

All 64 people are usually divided into separate alliances, communicating through a common linkshell. The typical alliances are, blackmage sleeping parties, assault parties, tanking parties, pulling parties etc. So you do the job that is asked of you depends on which group you're in, most of the time though its gang up on the mob that's not sleeping til it dies. All 64 people can lot on any drops that drop, this typically include AF2 piece (relics), relic weapons, ancient money and ingredients used to upgrade those weapons.

You have exactly 1 hour from when you enter dynamis to complete it. Generally there are several statues that will boost the time (extension) it is up to organizer to determine the path to hit all these statues in order to boost up the time to approx 3 hours. Limited time, hard mob, difficult pull and links are what these organizers have to deal with and they require the cooperation of everyone and won't take crap from anyone who "thinks they can do better" After beating several NM at certain locations it will pop the final NM and after he's dead everyone touch the ???? to get the title Dynamis something interloper.

So that's kinda Dynamis and HNM in a nutshell of what I've known and participate in. As of right now I've never fought any of the REAL HNMs except some gods. However ArchDominus will eventually get to them all and I hope I'll be there to participate.

Dynamis are held 3 times per week, if you have attended Dynamis you can't again for 4 real time days.

On Tuesday night Dynamis is held by : Iron Alliance
On Saturday Dynamis is held by : Lunarians
Also on weekeds some NA joined Dynamis held by :Daikon

So far those are the only ones I know that NA have joined. Please check their respective websites for more info.
#51 Oct 12 2004 at 3:09 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
You wanna talk hard hate control. Try controlling hate in a pt of mostly mages as a War/Thf in Yhoator. Gah! Such was my 26-27 experience =P


My set party has a Skillchain consisting of Sidewinder (600-900) -> Dancing Edge (500-800) which creates a massive distortion chain. If a NIN can hold hate on this (which I can and do), a NIN can tank fine ^^

Needless to say, sometimes it gets a bit stressful.
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