Sleepga overwritingFollow

Main thing to remember is that priority on enfeebles is not always necessarily determined by duration.

Although some people might not consider this to be an issue (although personally, I do think it would be nice to overwrite Lullaby with a Sleep 1...), it probably is something that could be addressed. I'm sure some of us remember how Blind and Flash used to be the same enfeeble, and enfeeblers would complain about PLDs/WHMs using Flash and constantly overwriting a 3 minute blind effect with a 10 second flash effect.

Why should SMN get a special sleep? All others are LIGHT or DARK, no specific element.

I see where your coming from but as a brd id like to see the lullabies at the top tier so I stop seeing no effect when I sing. As rdm I'd want sleep to have highest priority. As blu I want my spells to have the highest priority.

I hope you can see what I did there... because in the end the only way to make it "fair" is to have all sleeps overwrite all others or no others.

This is possibly the dumbest response ive seen.

I for one agree with mellowy in that sleep should be tiered so to avoid having enemies destroy people due to lullaby's 30 second duration compared to sleep's and sleep II's 1 minute and 1 minute 30 second durations.

You wonder why SMN should get a special sleep?


1. An ice elemental avatar casts the spell. Clearly this is a chance of making it ice elemental based to match the elemental owner.

2. Sleepga BP is bound to the same timer as buffs. Meaning to use this is to sacrifice damage potential of the whole party. BRDs do not share lullaby and minuet timers. CORs do not share Light Shot and Phantom roll timers. BLMs do not share Sleepga and Burst II timers and so on. It would be a slight bonus for something that is a bit more demanding to use.

3. It would make SMN a bit more original than just "same things as other jobs".



But don't get me wrong, I could see BLU sleeps being of different elements too (though I guess they have some form of color on their spell icons or so?). Light shot being Light, lullaby being light and sleepga being dark seems fine though.

1) Just because the avatar is ice based, doesn't mean the spell should be. Just because a monster is a certain element it doesn't mean all spells from them should be that element. It's like saying orc BLMs should be a fire based sleep. Or yags being wind.

2) SMN sleepga is hateless for the actual SMN on all mobs but the one you targetted, so I feel the sacrifice in damage/buff/whatever to be a fair trade. You don't see a BLM casting Thundaga or Sleepga and only gaining hate on one monster.

3) SMN is pretty original, no other job can mimic what a SMN can do really. Now, don't get me wrong though, I still think SMN needs tweaks, but I do think they are their own job.

And yes, BLU has both light and dark sleeps. Sheep Song (sleep1) and Yawn (sleep2) being light, and Soporific (sleep2) being dark.

On the other hand casting sleepga requires you to release your current avatar, spend 10 seconds summoning shiva, run up next to your target mob, BP, get hate, sleep the mobs, release before target mob is woken up by auto-attack avatars. I don't see BLMs dealing with that either.

Not to mention that if you use sleepga in dynamis you get hate on all of them, because dynamis has special re-aggro rules that make them link with closest mob as soon as their current target is lost. So in this case (and probably einherjar), your point is moot.

Sleepga overall is a BP that works better when applied over another sleep, which is why it would be nice with a change in priority. Now as long as the party has a RDM, WHM, BLM, BRD, COR, BLU, it is better if they sleep, since they are faster and more reliable. Nothing is worse than using up a global timer on "no effect".

You would want your 33 sec lullaby to overwrite a 90 second sleep2, just because you're the one singing it? Personally i'd rather waste my lullaby timer than do that...

I sure did. In fact, I still don't see it.

Is there anyone that wouldn't agree to having them tiered based on their duration?

It makes sense to selfish people, but not to team players. For example it is very selfish to say you'd rather your WS paralyze effect overwrote paralyze II.

Also, I have no idea why I missed putting Respose in the list. I assume it is 1 min duration? Or is it 1.5?

Why would you WANT a 30 sec sleep overriding a90 sec sleep? >.>

Unless you are trying to prove that you can sleep something or just being petty, there is no Logical or Good reason to have a 30 sec sleep override a 90 sec one, UNLESS there is about 5 seconds left on said 90 sec sleep. But having a spell wear in Tiers are timers get close would be too hard to program.

So suck up your Lullaby has no effect after you are late on a sleep that a mage beat you out on and deal with it.

Ballad costs no Mp, so all you lose is your recast, which is not that long anyway.

Mellowy's Tiers are Great, and its the most rational way for them to work, and its a shame they don't work this way.

Sorry Windexy, but you are just being selfish saying you'd want priority wherever you are, a Good player would not care that their spells are overridden, or if they get a no effect message, so far as the job is done and with the best effect on it.

Ps Mell, Repose is 1:30 Duration, same tier as Sleep 2, Repose will override Lullaby, Sleep and Sleepga 1, but will have no effect on Sleep 2, or Sleepga 2. I do know know about the Blu spells as i don't typically see a blu use their sleeps on whm. But repose Seems to work based on Tiers.

Edited, Aug 6th 2009 12:03pm by dmhlucky

Everything overrides all the blu sleeps, and they override nothing ;;

I completely agree, but that's not how I read it and no one bothered to make this clear until this post. Everyone else seems to stop reading after the word sing in my reply and quite clearly did not see what I did there.

Everything should overwrite the weak *** lullaby. If this is not the case for summoners I'm sorry for you guys because it should have been fixed long ago.

I still disagree with a ice based sleep though =P

Also, Repose can't be overwritten with Sleep 2/Sleepga 2. It is, for all intents and purposes, a light-element version of Sleep 2.