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gold Algol, do you want it?Follow
The best Greatswords @75:
WS: Balin, Algol, Valhalla(lol), Ragnarok(LOL)
DoT: Subduer, Algol, Ragnarok, Gold Algol+1
This is just my opinion......
Also on WS, Martial sword can be a contender for 100-200% spinning slash and groundstrike due to the TP enhancement, not to mention if u do a groundstrike @ 300% with Martial sword and hit Double attack on the WS, it will beat balin-algol-subduer if they did a 300% groundstrike DA proc.
Balind-Subduer-Algol: on a DA: first hit 300%, second hit 100%
Martial Sword: on a DA: First hit 300%, second hit 200%
WS: Balin, Algol, Valhalla(lol), Ragnarok(LOL)
DoT: Subduer, Algol, Ragnarok, Gold Algol+1
This is just my opinion......
Also on WS, Martial sword can be a contender for 100-200% spinning slash and groundstrike due to the TP enhancement, not to mention if u do a groundstrike @ 300% with Martial sword and hit Double attack on the WS, it will beat balin-algol-subduer if they did a 300% groundstrike DA proc.
Balind-Subduer-Algol: on a DA: first hit 300%, second hit 100%
Martial Sword: on a DA: First hit 300%, second hit 200%
Quote:
The best Greatswords @75:
WS: Balin, Algol, Valhalla(lol), Ragnarok(LOL)
DoT: Subduer, Algol, Ragnarok, Gold Algol+1
WS: Balin, Algol, Valhalla(lol), Ragnarok(LOL)
DoT: Subduer, Algol, Ragnarok, Gold Algol+1
Agreed...
Well, actually the Ragnarok may actually be able to out DOT them all since it's 100-300% TP "supposedly" has no effect on WS damage.
*EDIT* Ragnarok also has increased rate of Critical hits.... and Accurracy +20, and base DMG of 86. Too bad noone has yet to parse that ugly *** thing.
Edited, Nov 3rd 2006 at 7:32pm PST by Theodorik
Dark Knight LVL 75
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
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SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
You know whats funny? Other then the fact that Ragnarok has +20acc, and the occasional 2.5 dmg modifier, its truly nothing more then a upgraded subduer, honestly. Ragnarok gives an ok +crit percentage of about 10% where subduer is 6%, Ragnarok's base dmg is 86 where subduer is 85. Only diference is the ACC. As for other weapons, Algol also keeps up with them as well. If you think about it:
6% crit from Subduer, 10-15% from ragnarok: Crits add about 100 extra dmg give or take, its just a rough estimate. SO you take 100 hits, you got 600dmg extra from subduer, and 1000-1500 extra dmg from Ragnarok.
Algol's DMG is 85, triple proc +3%, added affect fire: triple proc means you will swing for about 100 + 100 + 100 if the hits connect and from triple 3%, thats already an added 600dmg going through 100 hits. The fire dmg that goes off is roughly 40% proc. the dmg can very from 20-60 so round it to 40. Out of 100 hits, it goes off 40 times, with an estiated 40dmg per proc. thats 1600dmg over the course of 100 hits:
Subduer 6%crit: 100hits= 600extra dmg
Ragnarok 10-15%Crit: 100 hits= 1000-1500 extra dmg
Algol 3%crit 100hits=600dmg, 40dmg fireproc 40%= 1600dmg
Thats just my look at it. I am also tired and may have confused a few things so feel free to correct me.
6% crit from Subduer, 10-15% from ragnarok: Crits add about 100 extra dmg give or take, its just a rough estimate. SO you take 100 hits, you got 600dmg extra from subduer, and 1000-1500 extra dmg from Ragnarok.
Algol's DMG is 85, triple proc +3%, added affect fire: triple proc means you will swing for about 100 + 100 + 100 if the hits connect and from triple 3%, thats already an added 600dmg going through 100 hits. The fire dmg that goes off is roughly 40% proc. the dmg can very from 20-60 so round it to 40. Out of 100 hits, it goes off 40 times, with an estiated 40dmg per proc. thats 1600dmg over the course of 100 hits:
Subduer 6%crit: 100hits= 600extra dmg
Ragnarok 10-15%Crit: 100 hits= 1000-1500 extra dmg
Algol 3%crit 100hits=600dmg, 40dmg fireproc 40%= 1600dmg
Thats just my look at it. I am also tired and may have confused a few things so feel free to correct me.
Aren't you upgrading the relic great sword Renzoukan?
Ferion: Male Elvaan, Gilgamesh
73 Drk 72 Smn 53 War 40 Thf
73 Drk 72 Smn 53 War 40 Thf
Renz,
You overlooked 2 key factors:
1) Ragnarok lower delay.
2) TP Bonus w/ Ragnarok
I'm pretty positive the Ragnarok will out-DOT anything.
You overlooked 2 key factors:
1) Ragnarok lower delay.
2) TP Bonus w/ Ragnarok
I'm pretty positive the Ragnarok will out-DOT anything.
Dark Knight LVL 75
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
And you overlooked another Fact. I am Renz therefore i win regardless of your argument. >,>
2 posts
Frodorn wrote:
You don’t need a Parser to compare 2 weapons... Just look at the Stats.
Algol
Base Dmg: 85 Delay: 489 Attack +3 Triple Attack +3% Additional Effect: Fire Damage
Subduer
Base Dmg: 85 Delay: 444 Critical Hit Rate +6%
Same Base Dmg
Subduer has 45 Less Delay, That’s 9.20% Faster
3% Triple Attack = 6% Haste
+3 Attack isn't much at all
Additional Effects on Weapons are a Joke... Unless its Sirocco Kukri
So it comes down to...
9.20% Haste > 6% Haste
+6% Crit > +3 Att, EnFire, and 3% chance to Triple Att in WS
Unless that Enfire is 100% Proc Rate, Subduer Destroys Algol in EVERY way.
What did you Need a Parser For Again????
Edited, Oct 25th 2006 at 8:21am PDT by Frodorn
Algol
Subduer
Same Base Dmg
Subduer has 45 Less Delay, That’s 9.20% Faster
3% Triple Attack = 6% Haste
+3 Attack isn't much at all
Additional Effects on Weapons are a Joke... Unless its Sirocco Kukri
So it comes down to...
9.20% Haste > 6% Haste
+6% Crit > +3 Att, EnFire, and 3% chance to Triple Att in WS
Unless that Enfire is 100% Proc Rate, Subduer Destroys Algol in EVERY way.
What did you Need a Parser For Again????
Edited, Oct 25th 2006 at 8:21am PDT by Frodorn
I'm surprised no one has shown up the obvious flaws in this calculation;
#1) 9.20% faster delay does not translate to 9.20% more haste, its just a faster swing, which means that it affects your TP gain in the balanced proportion with any other delay of weapon.
#2) Where the hell does 3% triple attack come to 6% haste? 3% triple attack means every 100 hits you get 6 extra swings yeah, but not haste. This is actually better than haste because you get an additional bonus of TP per time your triple attack procs. So lets say you get a proc off and you're gaining 13.3 TP per swing, thats 39.9 TP in a round. That right there automatically boosts your DPS higher than 6% critical can get it to since you're getting to your weaponskills faster. As much as you may deny it, WS are a part of DoT.
#3) Att+3, not as noticeable as other stats but its still a boost.
#4) Fire Dmg: Gone over this before many times by other people, go ahead and read what they said.
Where you got your information is kinda screwed up, and please for the love of god dont refer to something as haste, if its haste it does NOT affect your TP gain, just a pet peave from a NIN. God knows how much the DW patch screwed my TP build up, only haste helps anymore and I still see people getting supponamimi, wish i could trade mine for a bushonamimi.
Haste may not increase tp gain like it use to, but it still increases attack speed, which in return increases DoT.
Ferion: Male Elvaan, Gilgamesh
73 Drk 72 Smn 53 War 40 Thf
73 Drk 72 Smn 53 War 40 Thf
Quote:
And you overlooked another Fact. I am Renz therefore i win regardless of your argument. >,>
LOL, I like you, you're funny!
But seriously, if I was to take into account the 2-3X damage multiplier that is an inherent hidden trait of the Relic Weapons + WS Trait(100%TP=300%TP) + Delay shortened by 12(I think) + Higher Base Damage + 4% Higher Crit. Hit Rate.......... Ragnarok > Algol > Subduer for DoT. More than likely, you could WS hit HNM's harder too with the Ragnarok.
Maybe I need to focus my efforts onto the acquisition of this weapon.
Quote:
Haste may not increase tp gain like it use to, but it still increases attack speed, which in return increases DoT.
Um.....Haste does increase TP build still. That wasn't altered. Dual Weild has been slightly nerfed though in terms of TP build.
Edited, Nov 3rd 2006 at 10:52pm PST by Theodorik
Dark Knight LVL 75
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
2 posts
Ferriion wrote:
Haste may not increase tp gain like it use to, but it still increases attack speed, which in return increases DoT.
True enough, but if you were doing 100 dmg you'd barely be keeping up in DoT with the proc of the fire effect from algol alone using the subduer. After calculating the attack and the triple attack in theres no way you can beat it.
EDIT:
Haste has never had an affect on TP build, but thats why I'm pointing it out, since the seperation of a delay does not just mean its "haste" its just a weapon swinging faster with lower TP build.
Subduer - 11.4% TP
Algol - 13.3% TP
Reason I say it doesnt have an effect is because if you have 15% haste with algol equipped, its TP per hit will still be 13.3%.
Edited, Nov 3rd 2006 at 10:56pm PST by DarkRaije
Where did you get the post of that idiot going through subduer and algol like that? I didn't see it on this thread or did I miss something X_x....
To answer that question Renz....
DarkRaije wrote:
Forgot to mention, that was in response to Frodorn...
Frown down on Frodorn, oyvay...
Edited, Nov 4th 2006 at 6:16pm PST by Theodorik
DarkRaije wrote:
Quote:
I'm surprised no one has shown up the obvious flaws in this calculation;
#1) 9.20% faster delay does not translate to 9.20% more haste, its just a faster swing, which means that it affects your TP gain in the balanced proportion with any other delay of weapon.
#2) Where the hell does 3% triple attack come to 6% haste? 3% triple attack means every 100 hits you get 6 extra swings yeah, but not haste. This is actually better than haste because you get an additional bonus of TP per time your triple attack procs. So lets say you get a proc off and you're gaining 13.3 TP per swing, thats 39.9 TP in a round. That right there automatically boosts your DPS higher than 6% critical can get it to since you're getting to your weaponskills faster. As much as you may deny it, WS are a part of DoT.
#3) Att+3, not as noticeable as other stats but its still a boost.
#4) Fire Dmg: Gone over this before many times by other people, go ahead and read what they said.
Where you got your information is kinda screwed up, and please for the love of god dont refer to something as haste, if its haste it does NOT affect your TP gain, just a pet peave from a NIN. God knows how much the DW patch screwed my TP build up, only haste helps anymore and I still see people getting supponamimi, wish i could trade mine for a bushonamimi.
#1) 9.20% faster delay does not translate to 9.20% more haste, its just a faster swing, which means that it affects your TP gain in the balanced proportion with any other delay of weapon.
#2) Where the hell does 3% triple attack come to 6% haste? 3% triple attack means every 100 hits you get 6 extra swings yeah, but not haste. This is actually better than haste because you get an additional bonus of TP per time your triple attack procs. So lets say you get a proc off and you're gaining 13.3 TP per swing, thats 39.9 TP in a round. That right there automatically boosts your DPS higher than 6% critical can get it to since you're getting to your weaponskills faster. As much as you may deny it, WS are a part of DoT.
#3) Att+3, not as noticeable as other stats but its still a boost.
#4) Fire Dmg: Gone over this before many times by other people, go ahead and read what they said.
Where you got your information is kinda screwed up, and please for the love of god dont refer to something as haste, if its haste it does NOT affect your TP gain, just a pet peave from a NIN. God knows how much the DW patch screwed my TP build up, only haste helps anymore and I still see people getting supponamimi, wish i could trade mine for a bushonamimi.
Forgot to mention, that was in response to Frodorn...
Frown down on Frodorn, oyvay...
Edited, Nov 4th 2006 at 6:16pm PST by Theodorik
Dark Knight LVL 75
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
I mean his post wasn't on this thread. I saw what the other dude said about it and quoted it, but i don't see its original posting .
First page Renz, get some sleep LOL!
Dark Knight LVL 75
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
SAM75 WAR75
STR Gear SE/BW Gear
Penta-Smash SAM style
Epic Pants Lot
My Favorite Title
Disifer wrote:
lol
Hows buying an E body coming along?
Edited, Nov 6th 2006 at 9:27am PST by CaitsithFinal
Quote:
And no, I don't have one, I will have one within the next 2-3 weeks when my board comes back from RMA and I can get in and buy one for 2mil.
lol
Hows buying an E body coming along?
Edited, Nov 6th 2006 at 9:27am PST by CaitsithFinal
I have AIDS and I got it from Darkenbuddy.
CaitsithFinal wrote:
Disifer wrote:
lol
Hows buying an E body coming along?
Quote:
And no, I don't have one, I will have one within the next 2-3 weeks when my board comes back from RMA and I can get in and buy one for 2mil.
lol
Hows buying an E body coming along?
I'm not defending Disifer directly here, but anyone who decides to save up to purchase abj. such as the ones for e.body. Some servers have an excessive amount of drama around the ground kings that they would rather avoid camping them. Instead just save up and purchase the item from an LS that is willing to go through the hassle.
/shrug Not any different then purchasing items dropped from other NMs, BCNMs, KSNMs, ENMs, ect..
75DRK 75DRG 75DNC 75PLD
Quote:
Hows buying an E body coming along?
Thanks for adding something intelligent to the discussion. Oh, wait, I meant childish instead of intelligent.
Keep this crap off the drk forums, no one is going to think less of Disifer because of your useless comment.
Edited, Nov 6th 2006 at 10:48am PST by Ferriion
Ferion: Male Elvaan, Gilgamesh
73 Drk 72 Smn 53 War 40 Thf
73 Drk 72 Smn 53 War 40 Thf
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