I dont want to pullFollow

I dont know about you guys but I get tired of pulling. I get tired of having to sub NIN and run around for hours doing nothing else but pulling. I have pulled for acombined total of over 100 levels between both my THF and COR and I just get burnt out.

As of lately I put in my seacom {fisherman} {No Thanks}. What does every tell I get ask me??? Well heres what the convos usually look like.

<pt leader>: Hey
<me>: Hey
<pt leader>: Can you pull???
<me>: Did you see my seacom??
<pt leader>: yeah, so can you pull?
<me>: I can but I wont.
<pt leader>: So can you pull?
<me>: no bye

It makes me mad when people see a COR and think that all we can do is pull and not dd. I can put up close to or better numbers then some dds.

Are you 75? At merit parties COR is the absolute worst puller. I did not mind pulling up until merit party camps and all those parties leading up to 75 where I did have to pull I was still putting up some good numbers in terms of DD.

I too have the same search comment and I've only experienced problems with this one Bard that always ends up in the same party as me and he wants to sub WHM and doesn't like to pull. The leaders always coax him into it, but he always answers "COR can pull just fine" first. What he doesn't realize is that it takes us 7 seconds to fire our gun unless we spend a few hundred thounsand gil and buy a peacemaker which then gimps our damage, meaning the BRD can sit on his *** and toss a cure here and there but not contribute any damage while the COR has to gimp his damage so that he can still be a relatively slow puller. Party efficiency goes way down. Sometimes full party roaming is better than expecting a COR to pull.

If a BRD DCs or goes AFK, I'll usually assume the role of puller (even as COR/WAR) but if he's gone for more than 10 minutes I will pipe up saying we need
him to unAFK or find a replacement.

I would say that if you are in dire need of a party and just wanted to get those few bits of exp then just pull for the party, otherwise leave your search up, be patient and wait, and I'm sure a party will invite you without expecting you to pull.

I am not a fan of pulling.

That said, I managed Chain #123 using a Peacemaker. While the party was fighting the current mob I'd run out and pop a shot at the next, then Light Shot it when I got back to camp. If my Quick Draw timer was down I'd just Utsu tank the mob until the one the party was fighting was dead.

It wasn't hard and Corsair is far, far away from being "the absolute worst puller." I happen to think we're pretty damn good at it.

Before merit parties I wouldn't pull based on the facts that my gun delay is 600
+ and I would be out DDing any THF or DNC that I partied with, which would make those jobs much better candiates to disengage and pull. I had the same requests like the OP when I got an invite on /RNG or /WAR and had my comment set to to 'no thanks' on pulling. If the leader couldn't understand the simple argument about other jobs being better at pulling or just didn't want to hear it, I simply left the party.

Once I got to merit party level and picked up a Peacemaker, which was 50k on my server, and compared to the amount of gil I dished out on ammo that was just a drop in the bucket for me, I had no problem pulling if I got an invite into a party without a BRD. Us CORs don't appreciate being called BRD with a gun, but you can easily pull using mthods like BRDs use at merit camps. In fact, we surpass them on a few mobs like mamool NIN types because Light Shot goes through shadows. And when it comes to birds my record was chain #324 before I ran out of ammo/cards. In fact I think COR has an easier time pulling birds because of the length of our rolls being up for 5 minutes, and I can contribute a WS here and there for fun.

Although I enjoy going to a merit party /WAR or /RNG much more than /NIN for pulling, it doesn't really bother me too much when I'm getting 20k+/hour.

Just some gear tips for any COR/NIN who wants to pull in merit parties. Aside from the obvious Peacemaker a heavy AGI build and Light Staff will ensure that each mob will be slept each time. My current build is 40AGI with squid sushi; I use food so that I can land my shots when I pull so I can add up TP for a WS later on. Having a good Light Shot build is important because unlike BRD we only have 2 QD charges per 2 mintues(this will vary depending on merits). Along with my AGI build I also use our Relic hands for slightly quicker pulls and I keep my swift belt on to lessen my Ustu timers a little bit and I'm fortunate enough to have red legs which also make the pulling job easier.

tl:dr
Pulling is too much of a chore for most people pre merit parties. Once you get Peacemaker and Utsu:Ni it's a walk in the park.

Not to argue your whole point but...

Not every job ideally has a pebble/bow/dart/gun/bow/xbow/whatever equipped to help their DD. Jobs like COR, RNG, THF that typically use a pulling mechanism over a stat boosting ammo, to me, gives a slight nod to them as pullers.

High chain totals aren't necessarily indicative of why COR is an able merit puller. You can roam anywhere and chain forever - what makes COR a better than average choice, if you're going to designate a puller, is the nature of how our rolls work (potent, solid duration) along with Light Shot.

I'll be honest though - when I've been asked to merit pull, long long ago, the DD's could barely get past Chain 7. It was just atrocious. I made sure the mobs were there and rolls were up, but the kind of pick-up DD's you get asking a COR to merit pull are just not up to par for the most part. At least from my few experiances with it.

Some like to merit pull on COR - and with good DD's, I'm sure it works well. Personally I'd rather cut myself with a rusty blade then merit pull endlessly.. I've found that roaming, especially on Nyzul Mamools, can be very strong exp (as well as actually fun!). It didn't hurt that those parties were comprised of players from my Salvage LS, so they actually had strong gear and the brain cells to make it work smoothly. No BRD there; in fact we had a PUP, but they didn't suck, and legitimately contributed. Whatever style of meriting (or playing in general) you go with, players that know what they're doing will always trump those who don't or don't care.

So as far as meriting without a BRD, that's the only kind I really consider.. At this point, I'd only merit pull if a good friend asked me; fortunately they don't. Friends don't let COR friends merit pull!

Edited, Feb 23rd 2009 3:13pm by Carrilei

And switching from a tiphia sting to a chakram only makes you lose a tiny stat boost. Switching from martial to peacemaker cuts your WS damage in half.

I'm not suprised at all. This is also true with some RDM/BLMs, BLMs and other jobs that can AoE, and don't start with AoE (safely of course) to strip shadows/blink down.

Quick Draw shots do not get reflected.

I look at it this way. COR has two jobs in meripo. One is a buffer/DD and the other is a buffer/puller.

A buffer/puller is a COR/NIN meripoing (is that really a verb?) without a BRD. In that case, it makes sense for the COR to pull because he has enough time between rolls and shouldn't be outdamaging the dedicated DD's.

A buffer/DD is a COR/RNG(WAR, DNC) that meripoes with a BRD. In that case the BRD makes the better puller since he can't outdamage a COR. THe COR should then gear for DD and contribute to fast chains.

There are times I'm happy to be the puller. There are times I don't feel like pulling and would rather put my gear to the test and do some damage. On those days I'll put {Fisherman} {No, thanks} in my Seacom and refuse any invite that doesn't have a BRD. Sure I may not get as many merits that day, but i'm the type that would rather have fun than be efficient.

I feel from a bard's perspective that if there is a bard in the party, they should always pull. Other than that I feel the support should pull over the DD unless MP is the issue and not getting mobs to camp/sleeping them. Now when I say Support I also mean cor. But if the issue is killing speed? I'll pull on rdm, And just time it so it's getting to camp as last one dies and Dia pull. (Don't like other things reflected on me much)

Is this ideal? Probably not. But I feel that the "strongest" link in the party should pull. MP isn't an issue? Support pull. MP is an issue? A DD can pull after mobs die (or disengage slightly early) because you're not going to get real high chains anyway.

I've gone as far as whacking a mob to pull on melee because everyone in the pt with ranged refused. And if they will put up with someone going that far over them just using /ra or a song, then it says a lot about how they play.

Reasons why a COR should not pull in merit parties

• Our fastest gun sacrifices our WS and QD damage potential
• Almost any other job can equip a ranged attack weapon without sacrificing as much as a COR would have to
• /NIN again sacrifices our DD potential while some jobs natively sub NIN
• We have no method of sleeping multiple links, 2 light shots, on a 50-60 second timer does not cut it
• It further pushes the mentality that COR is only a support job and their DD potential gets completely ignored for any other part of endgame
• Despite other arguments that a COR has "quick" buffs, sometimes they can be extremely slow. Double-Up has an 5 second recast timer. If you have to double up three or four times in a row you've effectively used 20 seconds trying to get a single buff on the party and it might not even be a decent roll without doubling up further. The party can sometimes demolish a bird within that time. Not to mention that we only have 45 seconds to get our roll up to a decent number making it sometimes difficult to start a roll, pull, then try and get our roll to an acceptable level
• Further to rolling, maintaining a -decent- 4 roll rotation is almost always out of the question when having to pull
• We have the ability to out damage melees who do not gear properly (which does happen on occassion!)

Reasons suggested by others or attitudes I've come across why a COR should pull in a merit party

• There are no BRDs seeking - This is the number 1 reason we are asked to pull
• We natively use ranged attacks and are always using one
• The other members of the party shouldn't have to roam
• The other members of the party shouldn't have to sacrifice Acc+2 Attk+4 or some other mediocre stats so they can equip a ranged weapon
• Other members don't have access to any form of sleep - This one is legitimate
• We are invited for our rolls, not our DD

The only real reasons a COR should be pulling in a merit party

• The COR trusts the party he is with to keep him alive when %@^& hits the fan
• The COR doesn't mind fulfilling the pulling role for whatever reason
• The BRD in your party left or DC'd and a replacement BRD is on the way
• The COR is not well equipped for Melee TPing, Ranged Attack TPing, or does not have a good WS build, or just overall sucks apart from pulling

One thing I've noticed, before there were many CORs at 75, merit parties never left town without a BRD and most parties would disband if they lost their BRD. I believe there is a few reasons for this:

• They lost the party member who was pulling and no one else wants to step up
• They lost their buffer and refresher
• They would now have to rely on their healer for all sleeps - which can be tricky without any additional support

As CORs, I too believe we can fulfill the above but not as well as a BRD. We can pull, but not with the efficiency of a BRD. They have fast songs and can recast them very quickly if they are interrupted. We can buff, but not to the extent of a BRD - our rolls are based on randomness and we don't have a duplicate of any of our rolls. We can sleep, but not as easily as a BRD. What would you do if you had to pull a Mamool that had a pet and another one with a pet links with him only because you had to wait for your shot to go off? Thats 4 mobs. A BRD can cast one instant song and all of them would be asleep. As a COR, you can sleep 1, take the time to target another and sleep him, the melees start attacking one, and then unless your one of your melees provoke the last one off of you or the healer sleeps it, you're screwed. Then you also have to worry about one of the melees attacking the wrong one that you've just slept but you have to wait 50-60 seconds to sleep him again... Then what happens if you link on your next pull too and you still have 30 seconds till your next light shot? I've had BRDs who have had a tough time with links, and I've saved them many times by providing my extra sleeps.

So if a party was willing to disband or not leave town because of BRD issues, why do people think that CORs can replace a BRD? Simply put: We cannot. Asking a COR to pull is a bandaid solution and your party would probably be better off having the COR DD and just roam, and the COR can sleep when necessary.

If anyone out there wants to pull as a COR, be my guest, thats how you want to play. I am not trying to attack anyone with my post other than those who would not take a COR because they don't want to pull or forcing a COR to pull based on their ignorance of the capabilities of the job.

So based on all of this, and realistically BRD and COR are the only two jobs that are looked at for pulling, I think my argument still stands... COR is the absolute worst job for pulling in merit parties.




No need to be rude, I was simply voicing my opinion. My COR is 20/20 on merits, and while yes, I have other things I still have to merit I've never regretted putting {fisherman} {No Thanks} in my search comment as every merit party I've been in always had a BRD and at worst I've had to wait maybe 30 minutes for an invite. Every single party was more than capable of breaking C100 and going higher apart from AFKs or washroom breaks etc and every single one was 20k+/hour without Corsair's Roll.

The real problem is people see all these crappy CORs out there and think that pulling is all we are good for and thus they think all other CORs are just as equally terrible and expect all the rest of us to put up 2 or 3 rolls, pull, then pick our noses till we have to pull or put rolls up again. Sadly I have seen CORs in merit parties like this. This mindset propegates to all other endgame aspects and people don't think we can DD at all.

I'm totally with you on COR being a BAD puller for the north camp with all the mamool pet jobs. At least during that first pull cycle, it's wasy too easy to link two of them and bring 4 mobs back to camp. I suppose you can try pull the pets first and deal with them that way, but DRG mobs usually spawn another wyvern anyway. On birds though, that's easy prey. even MJSP is pretty easy, especially if you can grab the BST mamool mob before his pet pops. I usually just leave the DRGs for last.