Mathematics for MonksFollow

Mathematics for Monks

Below are some mathematics I put together for areas specifically pertaining to MNK's. There are some abilities like Counterstance, Dodge, and Focus that have no raw stats to go by, so I didn't even try to boggle my mind on those.

Boost

For each Boost, it will multiply your attack by 12% and with Temple Gloves equipped, 18.75%.

$ATT = Attack;
$NB = Normal Boost (No Temple Gloves);
$AB = Boost with Temple Gloves;
$TATT = Total Attack before next hit

Normal Boost: $ATT + $NB = $TATT(floor);
AF Boost: $ATT + $AB = $TATT(floor);

For example, if your ATT is at 220 + 12% = 246

On a side note, removing your Temple Gloves *may possibly* reduce your enhanced Boosts for Chi Blasting, even though you may not see your ATT number go down. However, it is best for you to go with what you think is best. Some people chose to swap on Devotee's, some people do not.

Counterstance

Granted, I have no clue what kind of value or number our Counterattack is at, nor do I have an idea how much Counterstance multiples or adds to that. However, after running further tests and the help of Kinematics (the person, not the science), we came to this conclusion:

DEF after Counterstance is activated = 1 + VIT / 2 + Any modifying job traits or abilities.

Chakra

Chakra's forumla is based solely on your VIT.

VIT x 2 = Total HP Recovered (Example: 60 x 2 = 120HP)

With AF1 Body Piece - Temple Cylcas:

VIT x 3 = Total HP Recovered (Example: 60 x 3 = 180HP)

With AF2 Gloves (in addition to AF1 Body) - Melee Gloves:

VIT x 3.6 = Total HP Recovered (Example: 80 x 3.6 = 288HP)

Currently, my macro for Chakra is the following:

/equip hands "Melee Gloves"
/equip body "Temple Cyclas"
/ja "Chakra" <me>
/wait 1
/equip hands "Alkyneous's Bracelets"
/equip body "Kirin's Osode"

I also throw on my Genbu's Kabuto to get some extra HP as well.

Focus

Focus doesn't really have a formula. But according to extensive research, Focus will give you a +20 ACC increase. With your Temple Crown it becomes +25 or +30 ACC. As well, I have also heard that if you pop Focus and then remove the crown, the +ACC bonus drops back to +20 as opposed to staying at +25. Really, I have heard of it going either way. Your best bet is to test it out yourself and see what you are most comfortable with.

Dodge

Dodge doesn't have a formula either. But also according to extensive research, Dodge will give you a +20 EVA increase. With your Temple Gaiters it becomes +25 EVA. Like Focus, if you pop Dodge and remove the gaiters, the +EVA bonus drops back to +20 instead of staying at +25. Really, I have heard of it going either way. Your best bet is to test it out yourself and see what you are most comfortable with.

Chi Blast

There is no confirmation on the following formula, but from my experience, this has been 80-90% accurate for me. This is all based on my own theory and I do not guarantee it is accurate. Chi Blast does ignore the mobs DEF, however, if the mob has Utsusemi or Blink up, the DMG will be absord and substantially less. Chi Blast is solely based on MND and Boosts, not ATT.

$MND = Total MND;
$BOOST = Total Boosts;
$RBMA = Normal Random Boost Multiplier (0.25 .. 0.60);
$RBMB = AF Random Boost Multiplier (0.75 .. 1.10);
$DMG = Total DMG from Chi Blast;

Without AF:
$MND * ($BOOST * $RBMA + 1) = $DMG(floor);

With AF (Temple Gloves Boosting):
$MND * ($BOOST * $RBMB + 1) = $DMG(floor);

For Example:

If you have 60MND and you boost for 10 times without Temple Gloves, the equation could look like this:

60 * (10 * .45 + 1) = 270

If you have 110MND and you boost for 11 times with Temple Gloves, the equation could look like this:

110 * (11 * .90 + 1) = 1089

When I made these examples, I stated the average or middle ground of the RBM (Random Boost Multiplier). Again, the theory of the RBM is solely my idea, it may not be accurate.

This formula is strictly based on Boosting prior to your Chi Blast, if you do not Boost, it will be a very small amount of DMG close to what your total MND is at.

Delay & Haste

Hand-to-Hand Delay

HTH = 480
HTH/MA1(1) = 400
HTH/MA2(16) = 380
HTH/MA3(31) = 360
HTH/MA4(46) = 340
HTH/MA5(61) = 320
HTH/MA6(75) = 300

$HD = Hand-to-Hand Delay;
$WD = Weapon Delay;
$TD = Total Delay on attacks;

$HD + $WD = $TD;

With my Spartan Cesti (113 WD) and HTH/MA5 (320 HD), my total delay is at 433.

Based on 1 real life second = 60 Delay.

$TD/60 or 433/60 = 7.2 seconds for each round of punches.

Now if we factor Haste into the picture:

We will use a Brown Belt, for example, which is 8% Haste.

So my $TD (433) - 8% = 398.36 TD. 8% of 433 = 34.64.

So we can do 398.36/60 = 6.6 seconds for each round of punches. That nearly shaves off half a second, which is noticeable. Thus, why Fuma Kyahan alone, is not very noticeable when it only represents 3% Haste:

433 - 3% = 420.01 TD. 3% of 433 = 12.99.

420.01/60 = 7 seconds for each round of punches.

As far as the Haste spell, it comes to 12%. I have found multiple RDM posts about this and proof with numbers.

Now if you wanted to see how this would impact your delay if you had a lot of haste gear, we could use this example:

Fuma Kyahan - 3%
Panther Mask - 2%
Byakko's Haidate - 5%
Black Belt - 12%

With a total of 22% Haste, we would see this:

433 - 22% = 337.74 TD. 22% of 433 = 99.8.

337.74/60 = 5.6 seconds for each round of punches. So if we threw in the haste spell on top of that:

433 - 34% = 285.78 TD. 34% of 433 = 147.22.

285.78/60 = 4.7 seconds for each round of punches. That is insane and if the 12% is true for the spell Haste, you could also get Advanced March and Victory March stacked from a BRD which is rumored to be another 12% combined.

Base Damage for Hand-to-Hand

(HTH Skill)/9.1 * 0.9 + 3 is the known equation.

My HTH is currently at 237, so it would be:

237/9.1 * 0.9 + 3 = 26.4 Base DMG

Now add my Spartan's Cesti Weapon DMG of +20 and the total is now 46.4 combined base and weapon DMG.

Oh yes, and for all of you Monks out there that hear from their buddies who use two-handed weapons about them having 40 or 60 DMG. Just think, my combined base DMG for 1 fist is 46.4, for boths fists that would be 92.8 base DMG. That is not even including Kick Attacks or Double Attack from subbing WAR. :-P

TP Return for Hand-to-Hand

Based on this equation that I have seen multiple times on JP sites:

((DELAY-180)/256) * 6 + 5 /2 = TP per fist

So for my delay of 443, it would be the following:

((443-180)/256) * 6 + 5 / 2 = 5.581 which rounds up to 6 TP per hit.

That's pretty much a given.

Monk Stats

This section is not really too mathematical, but as a guide of how these individual stats directly impact Monks.

STR:
1) Increases curve for DMG you can inflict
2) Increases Maximum allowed DMG - raises the ceiling
3) High STR is needed to directly overcome mobs high VIT
4) 2 STR = 1 ATT
5) 2 STR = 1 RATT (Ranged ATT)

VIT:
1) Lowers DMG curve that can be inflicted upon you
2) Lowers amount of DMG you will take depending on mobs STR
3) 2 VIT = 1 DEF
4) Increased VIT = Increased Chakra
5) Higher VIT also effects certain WS's for higher DMG
6) Your reduction in DEF for Counterstance relies on VIT

DEX:
1) Increases chance of critical
2) Increases critical DMG
3) Many people tend to believe that 2 DEX = 1 ACC since 2 STR = 1 ATT and 2 VIT = 1 DEF, however, this is not confirmed since we cannot see the raw ACC stat. However, according to SE DEX does have an impact on ACC.
4) While DEX could help with your Accuracy, you should never use substitue ACC for DEX. If that particular slot has an option for a DEX item or an ACC item, you should always go for the ACC.

AGI:
1) Increases Evasion
2) 2 AGI = 1 RACC (Ranged ACC)
3) Higher AGI is needed to overcome mobs high DEX

MND:
1) Directly raises DMG for Chi Blast's.

INT:
1) Helps with magical resistance which is not severely important.

CHR:
1) There are rumors that CHR helps certain WS's, but I have not found this to be factual and like INT, it does not appear to help a MNK much at all.

I did mention in here about Ranged Attack and Ranged Accuracy. Granted, we really don't have much, we can still throw the pebbles line for pulling when Chi Blast is still cooling down.

Stat Hierarchy:

 
Parent:         STR          AGI         DEX     VIT 
               /   \        /   \         |       | 
Child:       ATT   RATT   EVA   RACC     ACC     DEF

Weapon Skill Modifiers

I found this off of another thread on AK, but it will show how some stats can directly effect your WS DMG. Unfortunately it is not complete and I have been searching quite a bit to find the missing information, but I have not found it.

 
Hand-to-Hand WS		100%	200%	300%	#Hits	Secondary Attribute	TP Adjustment 
Combo			1.00	1.50	2.00	x3	STR_20%, DEX_20%		 
Shoulder Tackle		1.00			x2	VIT_30%			More stun 
One Inch Blow		1.00			x2	VIT_40%			Ignore more DEF 
Backhand Blow		1.00			x2	STR_30%, VIT_30%            Crit Rate 
Raging Fists		???	???	???	x5	STR_???		 
Spinning Attack		1.00			x2	STR_35%			Attack Radius 
Howling Fist		1.50	2.00	3.00	x2	STR_20%, VIT_50%		 
Dragon Kick		2.00	2.50	3.00	x2	STR_50%, VIT_50%		 
Asuran Fists		1.00			x8	STR_50% or VIT_50%          Accuracy 

Physical WS DMG Calculation:

WD: Base damage of your WS
D: Base damage of your weapon (i.e. Spartan Cesti = 20)
fSTR: difference between your STR and target's VIT
WSC: Secondary attribute like STR_50 (50% of your STR).
fTP: Multiplier (Please see chart above).
PDIF: (your ATK/target�s DEF)
WSC = integer(any secondary attributes) x @

Level @
Lv75... 0.83
Lv74... 0.83
Lv73... 0.84
Lv72... 0.84
Lv67... 0.86 or 0.87 (perhaps 0.87)
Lv60... 0.90 or 0.91 (perhaps 0.90)
Lv40... 0.94
Lv37... 0.94 � 0.99
Lv31... 0.94 - 0.99

For example, suppose you have 80 STR and 80 VIT and use Dragon Kick (STR_50%, VIT_50%):

WSC = integer[(80 * 0.5) + (80 * 0.5)] * @ = integer(40) * @ = 40 * @

@ = 0.86 or 0.87 at LV68 and it will decrease as you level up. It's 0.83 at LV75.

WD = (D + fSTR + WSC) * fTP

Actual Damage of WS is then calculated in this way:

DMG = WD * PDIF = (D + fSTR + WSC) * fTP) * PDIF

So in this example, let's say you are LV68 using Spartan Cesti and fighting a Tormentor in Den of Rancor and you use Dragon Kick at 200% TP. Your STR is 80, VIT is 80 and your ATT is 400, the Tormentor's VIT is 50 and it's DEF is 200. The equation would look like this:

WSC = integer[(80 * 0.5) + (80 * 0.5)] * 0.87 = integer(40) * 0.87 = 40 * 0.87 = 34.8 so WSC = 34.8
fSTR = 80 - 50 = 30
WD = (20 + 30 + 34.8) * 2.5 = 212 so WD = 212
PDIF = 400/200 = 2.0
DMG = 212 * 2.0 = 424 WS DMG

Now of course this does not factor in SATA, and I am just putting guesstimated numbers up for the VIT/DEF of the Tormentor. But you can get the jist of how it works.

The formulas and calculations were based and taken from the following thread:

WS Damage Modifiers

Damage Output Calculated

The equation I have seen most often is the following. There may be errors with this as I attempted to translate from a JP site:

DMG = (MNK_STR - MOB_STR)+(WPN_DMG * ((MNK_ATT/MOB_DEF)+3+ random(-0.5 .. +0.5)))

So based upon the example I put above with a Tormentor:

MNK_STR = 80
MOB_VIT = 50
WPN_DMG = 20 (Spartan's Cesti)
MNK_ATT = 400
MOB_DEF = 200
Random variable = 0.1 (Just as an example)

DMG = (80-50)+(20*((400/200)+3+(0.1))) = 43.1 DMG

Skill Ratings

The following will show our ratings for each skill that is for MNK. This does not including your SJ skills. Basically, the rating will let you know what MNK's excel in, and what we do not.

Hand-to-Hand: A+
Guard: A
Evasion: B+
Staff: B
Club: C+
Parry: E
Throwing: E


Edited, Wed Dec 28 02:52:08 2005 by DJSlyde

Thanks for the post, Slyde. I'm not very good with math, but can you or anyone tell me why for the base damage you have to divide by 9.1, multiply by 0.9 and add 3? I'm just wondering how those numbers factor in. Again, I'm not good with math so it might be something simple I'm not seeing. XD

Rate up!

EDIT: Accidently omitted a word. I should proof read my posts. :p

Edited, Wed Dec 8 20:20:33 2004 by FoxtheSly

FoxtheSly: That base DMG formula was found on a few JP sites as well as Effen's FAQ. Unfortunately neither of them had exact details on why those numbers were chosen, but I do know that it is the standard and it appears to be pretty accurate to me.

Geole:



Unfortunately, I haven't used Indra Katar's yet. However, it would seem to me, that if you are subbing WAR, it could possibly read out like this if everything goes perfectly during that round:

Fist 1
Fist 2
Double - Fist 1
Double - Fist 2
Triple - Fist 1
Triple - Fist 2
Kick

I cannot confirm this is 100% the case, but from what I have read on some of the forums, including the THF forum, this is how it would work if a THF with Triple Attack subbed WAR. Also, I have heard that the Triple Attack does not go off nearly as often as Double Attack does. I could be wrong since I do not know this from my own experience.

As far as Dune Boots, from all that I have heard, Dune Boots do not increase your kick frequency and also from what I have heard, Kick Attacks II doesn't either. :(



I am assuming for a & b you are talking about if you were subbing NIN for Dual-wield? I really have no idea which would do more DMG. I would be inclined to believe c would do the most DMG if subbing WAR, however, you would see more hits with a & B.

This needs to be stickied, it provided useful help for not just MNK but all DD's. Rate up!

I suppose they gave MNK's the option to use clubs just because they had nothing else to add to MNK. For me, I am glad we can use staves, just because of 2 weapons alone:

Kirin's Pole
Pride Staff

^^

Interesting read. Only correction I have is that I'm pretty sure 100 delay = 1 second, but you list it as 60 delay = 1 second.

With brown belt and Byakko's haidate 3 seconds a combat round seems much more accurate than 5.

With double bard haste + whm haste I can get my combat rounds under 2 seconds with Vishnu's Cesti.

Good work on the equations though.

Hmm, I will double check this tonight with a stopwatch. Thanks for the input. ^^

- Agreed: the KungFu/Wulong (Dune Boots: have not personally tested) do NOT increase frequency of kicks.

lv71 Kick Attack II bonus... have yet to show an increase in kick rate for me. same rate as before, although it DOES DO more damage now. like i mentioned before, if lv51 kick was 50% of punch... lv71 kick is roughly 75%.

Nice post Slyde! I think this one needs to be stickied..

Few things though:

You posted that with Melee Gloves you get VIT X 3.6 HP recovered by using Chakra. Is that combined with AF Body or just the Melee Gloves alone? Does the effect on these items stack?

You also posted that VIT affects certain WS damage. I think this information is false or at least unsupported by anything concrete.

On haste and delay, I think these are both extremely important for Monks. Looking through output from my parser, I tested Shiva Claws VS. Cross Counters on IT Lizards and Monkeys in Den of Rancor.

On several occasions, while hasted, Shiva Claws actually managed to outdamage the Cross Counters overall in fights with and without weaponskills. I also noticed I was pulling a lot more hate with Shiva Claws than I was with the CCs and while Berserked (With BRD ATK Up Song also) the damage per fist was very close to CCs, however, the CCs tended to outdamage the claws by a decent margin per fist while Berserk was down. Although there a ton of other factors such as critical hits, double attacks, kicks, BRD songs not being up, etc.. that can skew the numbers I was very surprised at how close the damage was between the two weapons.

The additional "Paralysis" effect on the claws was also very helpful to our NIN tank. ^^;

I'd like to try out some Vishnu's eventually but the DMG rating which is even 4 below Shiva Claws has me a bit worried..



I'm not level 71 yet so I can't comment on Kick Attacks II but I have been wearing Kung Fu Shoes since level 51 and just upgraded to Wu Long Shoes and kick attacks fire off very frequently for me in combat, at the very least 1-3 times per fight with WAR subbed. I don't think anyone can conclude that these shoes do not increase kick frequency nor can it be concluded that they don't because there simply isn't any listed attributes for these items and the ability is way too random to begin with.

Does anyone know the formula for amount of damage on a WS to a IT mob? I know every WS is based on different stats. For example howling fist and dragon kick are based on STR and VIT. When i use howling fist or dragon kick on IT my damage goes from 160~ to 400~ with 100TP but most of the time is low damage around 200~ or so, even when i don't miss any hits. What stats am I lack of? I'm guessing my STR is a little low since i have my accuracy gears on when i use WS. BTW I'm 66 taru mnk atm ; ;

At 300% TP with optical hat on, my dragon kick lands for about 800-1200 on Aura Pots in sky. (War Sub)

At 300% TP with Genbu kabuto (+15 VIT) on, my dragon kick lands for 900-1600 on Aura Pots in sky. (War Sub)

I should be farming water tonight. I'll record the results and post tomorrow if you want. I have a hard time being objective though- I'm a galka, so VIT affecting weaponskills for monk is beyond ideal for me.

How odd. Any time I've measured it, it's come out to 60 delay == 1 second. Guess I'll need to see if I made any mistakes in my measurements.

Having played Thief to 57 I can confirm that Triple Attack & Double Attack will not fire off on the same attack. You have a chance to trigger each...but you won't get 2 x Double and then Triple to fire in the same round. It may look like it is though (due to animation).

Triple tended to go off fairly often as a Thf/Nin. Not quite the frequency as Double Attack on Mnk/War or Thf/War, but pretty close. Definately more than the 1% afforded from Indras.

The ultra rare 2 x Triple Attack plus a Kick in one round would be something to see though. Free Asuran Fists!

Nice post Slyde. ^^

*Spelling edits*

Edited, Thu Dec 9 17:42:33 2004 by NameAlreadyTaken