Thief always gets the shaftFollow

Good point. So in reality, THF could get A+ in any weapon they can currently equip, and it wouldn't make any significant difference.

DRKs will still close SCs harder with SATASpinslash than anything we can throw at it.

MNKs will still outdamage us on bones... and in retrospect, since 225 WSes are SP, THF wouldn't be able to close a Light SC with club or H2H (even with an A+) until Black Halo at LV71.

In a nutshell, all the jobs that are picked over THF for a given situation will still be picked over THF in that situation, for all the same reasons.

So again, I'm really interested in hearing what the goal of all the whiners in this thread is. Give THF an A+ in any of our weapons, and we'll still be clutching our daggers to the grave. Give us access to those quest WSes that are apparently such a big deal, and we'll continue to ***** the same dagger WSes we are using now.

Edited, Mon Feb 14 09:10:54 2005 by redvenomweb

It wouldn't hurt monk at all >.>

We'd still have to sub monk for H2H speed bonuses, but still attack slower.(and most likely weaker than monk)

What this would do, is increase thf's effectiveness against bone mobs. So when the PT wants to level off skellys <.<; you'd get a damage bonus instead of a penalty.

Silver Bullets and better guns. SATA + Slugshot Yes,please!!!

Oh yeah and make that for THF main only so that RNGs cant do the same thing as us but better like DRKs do

Such drama in this thread.

1) I never said that.
2) You said, "You're right, it wont make a difference." Go ahead and look, it's right at the top of this page.


No, I said that we would make them take a back seat for longer. By that, I meant that a MNK invited to close a non-light SC would be potentially replaced by an A+ H2H THF. In any case, if your whole argument is that THF is shafted because they don't get bone PTs, that's just being petty. MNK deserves to have bone PTs, after the garbage they go through for the first sixty levels.


We all know that THF sucks against bones. I don't think that that is something that should be "fixed." But whatever, cry all you want. I will say one thing: THF has more options against bones than RNG or DRG. But oh well.

As far as golems go, they are not strong or weak to any particular weapon type. So what WS would you propose to use against them instead? Savage Blade? Black Halo? Please, fill in the details.

I think Nynjaa said at least said B+ somewhere in this infinite void of thf.

Everything you said was bs. I mean as I've said before getting an A+ in marksmanship will never happen, but if it did it would change a thiefs role in all parties. However, how would you, as a fledgling thief know this? Well, you obviously don't.

The point is landing status bolts without sacrificing other vital roles a thief plays in a party... This does not make an argument for thf/rng because you simply sacrifice too much by not subbing either ninja or warrior. Also you seem to think a thiefs only role is weaponskills and the only reason to give us a better skill rating is for that purpose, why? If you think getting faster TP and debuffing the monster at the same time (causing you and other party members to do more damage) is useless then you're just a bad thief. I'm not even the one who brought up giving thief an A+ in marksmanship anyways, you just commented that it "wouldn't change anything" or something to that effect. That is simply a stupid comment.

I also clearly remember saying that I'm not interested in higher weapon ratings, did you miss that? Yeah, guess you did, shut your mouth now. If you read my other posts you'd see that I think the best "fix" would be additional job traits that boost the power of sneak attack and trick attack or just, at a certain level, give us sneak attackII and trick attackII in exchange for sneak attack and trick attack. The level for these abilities should be somewhere around 70, when thief really starts to show a lack of power. That or perhaps some other abilities/traits that allow us to contribute more in HNM and god fights. As I've also said thief as it is now is not a bad job that is of little use without a "fix", but as "hate control" loses its appeal in exp parties and endgame fights it would be nice to have more respectable and reliable damage. That's something we simply don't have now at later levels. It's simply ridiculous that other jobs can handle hate control just as good as we can while doing more damage, at later levels that is.

We could close fusion with True Strike. Even with an E rating in club SAnTA/True Strike does 700-800. It would also mean that our normal SAnTA wouldn't completely suck on bones. Club makes more sense than H2H from an RP standpoint too. A wooden cudgel is a classic "brigand" type weapon.

Edited, Tue Feb 15 06:49:09 2005 by Lobivopis

THF are tricky^^ We are the best hate controllers in the game, and are in general light and quick. I think it was a very big deal for SE to give us access to crossbows and status bolts. Sure, we can't solo serket as easily as a RDM/NIN or NIN/RDM could, but i've heard good arguments that say we could do it.

I was solo exping next to a DRK at the same level as I. He got taken down by an easy prey caveberry. It has been a long time since i've started a fight full and lost to an easy prey. I killed an EP berry for 43 exp and didn't drop under half health.

We're the only jobs that can pick chests/coffers too. I make alright money going to davoi and stealing from orcs and picking chests. I am exping the rest of the way to 50 (@1.5k w00t!) there on DC orcs (except the monk types, they suck hard).

IMO the most screwed job is DRG. Not only can they not wear any of the totally sweet top level stuff (not sure what abjuration set they get though), but they only get a total of 3 job traits i think. Attack bonus is nice, but WAR gets it too, and DRK gets 3 of it. Accuracy bonus is also nice, but they only get one of that too. Dragon killer was nearly a waste since dragons are so rare in the game. I think SE knew they had flubbed there, so they put more dragon types in the CoP areas.

Job abilities are only call wyvern, spirit link, jump/high jump/super jump. Their 2hr is highly useful, but defnintely the strangest of the 2hr abilities. Every other job has its 2hr as a quick burst of something that the job is known for. WHM heals, PLD becomes immune to physical blows, THF dodges, DRK drains life, etc etc. DRG have their 2hr out the whole time if they're lucky. It's considered more a standard than it is an emergency backup.

The innate accuracy bonus is barely compensation for the fact that they can't wear a lot of the usual ACC+ gear (or so i hear). Not only that, but lots of mid-end game enemies are strong against piercing attacks (THF share in this woe) and DRG get looked over for lots of places with armored enemies. Polearm is pretty much the only weapon worth wielding for the entirety of DRG's career. They have only a small handfull of innate combat capabilities:

Polearm: A+
Staff: B-
Parrying: C
Evasion: C-
Sword: C-
Club: E
Dagger: E

However, with a wyvern by its side, DRG deals excellent damage over time. Later on, they're also good for a DRK's SATA partner. They can take 1000+ points of trick damage and shed the hate.

Thieves, although very good damagers, aren't damagers at their core. We're all about being sly and sneaky. Are any other jobs as sly and sneaky as mine? No? Well then i'm happy with the job i chose to play^^

Edit: WTD? I didn't mean to respond to this thread.

Edited, Tue Feb 15 09:15:12 2005 by HunterShu

Without even thinking, one way they could make SA/TA better but not groundbreaking is to make it add 3.5 or 4 damage/dex(or agi) instead of the 3 it is now. >.> <.<