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WoW expansion set ?Follow

#1 Jul 11 2005 at 8:00 AM Rating: Decent
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Hold your horses :) this is just my fantasy at work.

I've been "contemplating" what the future might hold for the WoW franchise, and although Blizzard seems to have things thought and planned out for the upcoming year at least, I've allowed myself to dream of what an expansion set of WoW might look like.

Sargeras was the bronze Titan in charge of fighting the demonic entities from the Twisted Nether, and making sure order-as-planned by the Pantheon (ruling elite sect of the Titans) was to ensue.

Upon facing the Nathrezim (Dreadlords)and the Eredar, and defeating them, he was changed into evil and chaos, he then freed them and chose Eredar's greatest champions : Archimonde and Kil'Jaeden to spread chaos in the Great Void (i.e Universe) ...etc

The above was not my imagination, it is the official history of warcraft.

I think the expansion set of WoW should be WoW : Outworld . It takes place in Outworld, where the burning legion agents reside, and where Illidan fled after failing to destroy Arthas. It should look something like the Wasteland in Mortal Kombat the movie, where reptile is ....etc.

New classes include Demons , dreadlords (vampires)....etc, and perhaps the Boss is Sargeras himself, the Great Titan who made the burning Legion in the first place.

I'd like the level cap to be 100, and only lvl60s on the original WoW to join, perhaps through the Dark Portal :) That way lvl60s can have a place to go once they hit the cap, and the lower levels can still enjoy the original game.

What do you think ? What would you like the expansion to look like ?
#2 Jul 11 2005 at 12:57 PM Rating: Decent
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I think that when Blizzard does release an expansion for Wow that it will have zones for all existing levels (even 1-10... if you are going to make new playable races then you need to give them somewhere to start playing right?!). I've just started playing the game at all so I'm ok with waiting, but I have to admit that having the level cap boosted would be pretty cool. The only thing that I would be concerned with is that they release a product that is as well thought out and fun as WoW itself.
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#3 Jul 11 2005 at 1:05 PM Rating: Decent
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God damn level cap need to stay at 60 >_<. GRRRRR Smiley: mad

Nobody who's level 60 want the level cap to raise >_<. How about you get to 60 and see if you still feel like leveling? :P

Aside from that, the outland idea is pretty interesting.
#4 Jul 11 2005 at 1:11 PM Rating: Decent
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Agreed.

The lvl cap is just fine. Give us more content, not a higher number on our char info screen. Sheesh.
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#5EricGraham, Posted: Jul 11 2005 at 2:10 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I would LOVE the lvl cap to be above 60 I dont know why you dont its amazingly easy to get to 60 in a month.
#6 Jul 11 2005 at 2:54 PM Rating: Decent
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EricGraham wrote:
I would LOVE the lvl cap to be above 60 I dont know why you dont its amazingly easy to get to 60 in a month.

Yeah, if you don't do anything else but play WoW. For the "responsible" world, it takes much more time than that.
#7 Jul 11 2005 at 7:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Well the thread was supposed to be more about the Outworld idea, the mythology, the theme, your ideas for an expansion set, so it wouldn't be more of the same thing.

Anyway, since you guys stuck on the lvl60 cap issue, you can barely beat Onyxia with a 40 lvl60s raid, do you expect to beat Archimonde The Defiler, or Kil'Jaeden, or Illidan, or even Sargeras the Creator of the Burning Legion and initial Conserver of the Worlds, with the same team.

You're right though, it would consume a lot of time to lvl to say .. 100, but then if you don't feel the need for the more "hard-core" extension of the game, don't buy :) tons of people still play Warcraft3 and enjoy it thoroughly.

Your ideas on an expansion set please :)
#8 Jul 11 2005 at 10:00 PM Rating: Decent
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Maybe you guys have forgotten something called TALENT TREES? Raising the level cap 40 levels will create a major inbalance. Take for example my mage. I right now have the ult. frost spell - frost barrier. Now if i was lvl 100 i would also have the ult arcane spell with only 11 more points put in and that would leave 29 into my fire tree. So basically i would pretty much have everything. Or lets imagine something else. The ult fire spell is Combustion which garuntess the next fire spell to crit. Now if you have that spell it is IMPOSSIBLE for you right now to get the arcane spell Presence of mind which makes any spell an instant cast. Now if the level cap was raised a single point you would be able to get both of these. What does this mean? You would be able to do 1.5k damage easily and while running too. So lets see a mage battle after that. Sheep > Pyroblast (1k damage) > Fireblast (Instant cast 400 damage) > Combustion + Presence of Mind + Pyroblast (1.5-2k damage) = One burned mother focka. Especially when you consider that the target wont be able to pull off any spells between all that damage.

Edited, Mon Jul 11 23:06:09 2005 by Ruikoden
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#9 Jul 11 2005 at 10:03 PM Rating: Decent
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Where did EricGraham write that? Must have been filtered.

Anyway, the levels need to stay at a cap of 60. Blizzard designed the game with 60 being the end of the game, skill-wise. Adding levels means, if nothing else, adding more talent points, which could wreak havoc on their balance system. Furthermore, I've seen what adding levels did to Everquest, and the game probably would have been a lot more pure if the game had stayed at a cap of 60. (Granted, it was originally 50 in EQ, but it was 60 for 3 years following Kunark's release.)


Quote:
Anyway, since you guys stuck on the lvl60 cap issue, you can barely beat Onyxia with a 40 lvl60s raid, do you expect to beat Archimonde The Defiler, or Kil'Jaeden, or Illidan, or even Sargeras the Creator of the Burning Legion and initial Conserver of the Worlds, with the same team.


Yes. Just a matter of gear and maybe hero classes. And don't forget, guilds have turned Ragnaros into a loot farm. He's supposed to be some kind of god.

However...I anticipate that Outworld will be the *second* expansion - the first being the remaining territories in Azeroth like Mount Hyjal, Quel'thalas, Northrend, etc. - and that the second will maybe offer some change to the level cap.


The OP is not a bad idea, but I think if you want to consider dreadlords and the burning legion to be very powerful, it would be an excellent place to jump into AFTER we deal with the remaining Scourge. (I dunno about beating Arthas, but Kel'thuzad and the rest of his minions would be possible to deal with.)
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#10 Jul 11 2005 at 10:06 PM Rating: Default
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I reaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllly want a like little pet voucher that comes with it, like collecters edition.

And like a little action figure of a Race from WoW
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#11 Jul 11 2005 at 10:53 PM Rating: Decent
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I didn't lay out any specific modifications. I just wondered and imagined what a standalone expansion (like WC3:Frozen Throne) for WoW would look like.

As for the talents ...etc, I'm sure Blizzard can find a solution to that, maybe more talents, maybe new talent trees, who knows.

Sure all of that comes after at least 1-2 years from date, since -like I said- they have plans and patches already planned out for the rest of this year. I realize that there's still so much to do in WoW as it is.

But just imagine what an expansion would look like, a new package, what would you like to see ?

Edited, Tue Jul 12 02:07:52 2005 by GregoryTheWatcher
#12 Jul 12 2005 at 5:29 AM Rating: Decent
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hmmm interesting.

I didn't about the history background, but your idea seems to rhyme fine....... I'd love to get a shot at Illidan ,Archimonde, or any of these people that I saw in WC3, come to think of it, Illidan was my fav char ever, lean and mean :P

Any idea where I can read up that history you mentioned ?
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#13 Jul 12 2005 at 5:37 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Anyway, since you guys stuck on the lvl60 cap issue, you can barely beat Onyxia with a 40 lvl60s raid,


Done it with 30. And we have Ragnaros on farm status.
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#14 Jul 12 2005 at 9:19 AM Rating: Default
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Edited, Tue Jul 12 10:22:59 2005 by NeoCzar
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#15 Jul 12 2005 at 9:21 AM Rating: Decent
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That's hardly the point, I believe that an expansion should be challenging, not more of the same thing but with different "looks", suppose you can turn Ragnaros into a farm "*****", would you want to shell another 50 dollars or so to beat the same difficulty bosses ?

Therefore they should be much more difficult, logic follows that if a puny boss like Ragnaros (in comparison with Sargeras, Illidan, or Archimonde) can be beaten and turned into a loot farm by lvl60s, that the future bosses should require higher lvl players.

And this is all suppose 1-2 years from now, by then I'm sure most of us would be bored of doing xxxxx runs in MC and Stratholme/Scholo/BRD ...etc, and would be looking forward to more developments.

Anyway, so whats your idea of an expansion set then? Maybe you could fill me in. I just shared mine, you share yours.
#16 Jul 12 2005 at 9:32 AM Rating: Decent
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Any idea where I can read up that history you mentioned?


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#17 Jul 12 2005 at 9:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Actually, I had bought the WarCraft3 Battle Chest about 3 years ago, the official manual has about 65 pages of history, each race, each hero's history, and the origins of the burning legion.

Maybe I should type it out here ?
#18 Jul 12 2005 at 9:49 AM Rating: Excellent
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Quote:
Any idea where I can read up that history you mentioned ?


They have quite a bit of history and lore on the official website. (Going slow right now... patch day...)

Besides just the website they also have many novels, RPGs and even an eBook.

Also, every single Warcraft game comes with some sort of history written in the manual.

Enjoy!
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#19 Jul 12 2005 at 10:09 AM Rating: Decent
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Since Gregory is pushing for members ideas on the expansion, not elaborating on the original post, here's a couple of mine.

New classes. Oh how I wanted a character modelled after the Pitlord and Dark Ranger from wc3. I know the hunter can be considered the Dark Ranger, but slapping a bow on a char and giving it pet tame abilities isn't the same. Sorry.

A co-faction bar. Or something. Some small area, way the hell off in the middle of no where, where characters from ALL factions could co-exist. Even if it's only inside one small bar/tavern/instance/whatever.

More end game content. How many times have I talked to lvl 60's and they've said how little there is to do at 60. Yes there's now BG's, run end game instances, raids here and there that only yield PK's/Honor points, and...*long pause*...that's it. I'm for a small contenient or w/e that's alot bigger than say MC runs, for only 60's to explore. Or something.

Keep in mind. Just random ideas from some newblet. Though goddam I wanted a DR *sigh*
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#20 Jul 12 2005 at 10:10 AM Rating: Decent
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The Titans and the Shaping of the Universe :

No one knows exactly how the universe began. Some theorize that a catastrophic cosmic explosion sent the infinite worlds spinning out into the vastness of the Great Dark - worlds that would one day bear life forms of wondrous and terrible diversity. Others believe that the universe was created as a whole by a single all-powerful entity. Though the exact origins of the chaotic universe remain uncertain, it is clear that a race of powerful beings arose to bring stability to the various worlds and ensure a safe future for the beings that would follow in their footsteps.

The Titans, colossal, metallic-skinned gods from the far reaches of the cosmos, explored the newborn universe and set to work on the worlds they encountered. They shaped the worlds by raising mighty mountains and dredging out vast seas. They breathed skies and raging atmospheres into being. It was all part of their unfathomable, far-sighted plan to create order out of chaos. They even empowered primitive races to tend to their works and maintain the integrity of their respective worlds.

Ruled by an elite sect known as the Pantheon, the Titans brought order to a hundred million worlds scattered throughout the Great Dark Beyond during the first ages of creation. The benevolent Pantheon, which sought to safeguard these structured worlds, was ever vigilant against the threat of attack from the vile extra-dimensional entities of the Twisting Nether. The Nether, an ethereal dimension of chaotic magics that connected the myriad worlds of the universe, was home to an infinite number of malefic, demonic beings who sought only to destroy life and devour the energies of the living universe. Unable to conceive of evil or wickedness in any form, the Titans struggled to find a way to end the demons' constant threat.


Sargeras and the Betrayal:

Over time, demonic entities made their way into the Titans' worlds from the Twisting Nether, and the Pantheon elected its greatest warrior, Sargeras, to act as its first line of defense. A noble giant of molten bronze, Sargeras carried out his duties for countless millennia, seeking out and destroying these demons wherever he could find them. Over the eons, Sargeras encountered two powerful demonic races, both of which were bent on gaining power and dominance over the physical universe.

The eredar, an insidious race of devilish sorcerers, used their warlock magics to invade and enslave a number of worlds. The indigenous races of those worlds were mutated by the eredar's malevolent powers and turned into demons themselves. Though Sargeras' nearly limitless powers were more than enough to defeat the vile eredar, he was greatly troubled by the creatures' corruption and all-consuming evil. Incapable of fathoming such depravity, the great Titan began to slip into a brooding depression. Despite his growing unease, Sargeras rid the universe of the warlocks by trapping them within a corner of the Twisting Nether.

While his confusion and misery deepened, Sargeras was forced to contend with another group intent on disrupting the Titans' order: the Nathrezim. This dark race of vampiric demons (also known as dreadlords) conquered a number of populated worlds by possessing their inhabitants and turning them to the shadow. The nefarious, scheming dreadlords turned whole nations against one another by manipulating them into unthinking hatred and mistrust. Sargeras defeated the Nathrezim easily, but their corruption affected him deeply.

As doubt and despair overwhelmed Sargeras' senses, he lost all faith not only in his mission, but also in the Titans' vision of an ordered universe. Eventually he came to believe that the concept of order itself was folly, and that chaos and depravity were the only absolutes within the dark, lonely universe. His fellow Titans tried to persuade him of his error and calm his raging emotions, but he disregarded their more optimistic beliefs as self-serving delusions. Storming from their ranks forever, Sargeras set out to find his own place in the universe. Although the Pantheon was sorrowful at his departure, the Titans could never have predicted just how far their lost brother would go.

By the time Sargeras' madness had consumed the last vestiges of his valiant spirit, he believed that the Titans themselves were responsible for creation's failure. Deciding, at last, to undo their works throughout the universe, he resolved to form an unstoppable army that would set the physical universe aflame.

Even Sargeras' titanic form became distorted from the corruption that plagued his once-noble heart. His eyes, hair, and beard erupted in fire, and his metallic bronze skin split open to reveal an endless furnace of blistering hate.

In his fury, Sargeras shattered the prisons of the eredar and the Nathrezim and set the loathsome demons free. These cunning creatures bowed before the dark Titan's vast rage and offered to serve him in whatever malicious ways they could. From the ranks of the powerful Eredar, Sargeras picked two champions to command his demonic army of destruction. Kil'jaeden the Deceiver was chosen to seek out the darkest races in the universe and recruit them into Sargeras' ranks. The second champion, Archimonde the Defiler, was chosen to lead Sargeras' vast armies into battle against any who might resist the Titan's will.

Kil'jaeden's first move was to enslave the vampiric dreadlords under his terrible power. The dreadlords served as his personal agents throughout the universe, and they took pleasure in locating primitive races for their master to corrupt and bring into the fold. First amongst the dreadlords was Tichondrius the Darkener. Tichondrius served Kil'jaeden as the perfect soldier and agreed to bring Sargeras' burning will to all the dark corners of the universe.

The mighty Archimonde also empowered agents of his own. Calling upon the malefic pit lords and their barbarous leader, Mannoroth the Destructor, Archimonde hoped to establish a fighting elite that would scour creation of all life.

Once Sargeras saw that his armies were amassed and ready to follow his every command, he launched his raging forces into the vastness of the Great Dark. He referred to his growing army as the Burning Legion. To this date, it is still unclear how many worlds they consumed and burned on their unholy Burning Crusade across the universe.

That was the relevant excerpt "to my fantasy :p" .

Click here http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/story/chapter1.html;jsessionid=949A4AA17110779B7DD4CD1C5FC57C28.app01#1

for more :)

Enjoy, I did.....




#21 Jul 12 2005 at 10:20 AM Rating: Good
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I think the expansion will be a new landmass, probably not as big as kalimdor or azeroth but more condensed (less wasted space.)

I really don't think they'll have new classes or races with it, at least not ones that players can play.

I'm really hoping for higher levels/hero classes or alternate advancement ( like EQ1.) This has been the LARGEST WoW design flaw for me, you just get 60 and sit there. To me, that is character death. Everquest kept me playing for FIVE FREAKING YEARS, ONLY because my character NEVER hit the cap (NOT ONCE!)

I was level 48 on my druid when kunark came out (level 50 cap previous to that)

I was level 52 when velious came out (yeah, levels above 50 really hit me hard as a soling druid at the time)

I was level 54 or 55 when Luclin came out.

Planes/dungeons I was around level 57

Now I've not played it again since the city of heroes/wow betas ;) But it is something I might go back to.
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The important thing here is how long the game kept me playing, simply because I always had a "goal." WoW doesn't have that since I was level 60 on TWO characters a couple months into the retail game, while I don't play any different than I did in Everquest 1. In fact, due to WoW being so "easy" and hitting the cap so soon, I probably play LESS than I did in EQ1.

So the level cap is not "fine." It is the exact opposite. It is totally unfine. It is the worst design element of this game:

A player should NEVER be hitting the cap, then just stagnating for months and months. This should never be happening, especially not to a more casual player like me who spends 75 percent of their time messing around with trades and junk.

The NUMBER ONE reason I am getting tired of this game, being more likely to just quit/leave and go back to COH or EQ1(barf!), is that I have two characters (which is all I really want) who sit at level 60 and stagnate.

More "content" is moot to me, without more character growth. Alternate advancement in Everquest 1 was the stuff of genius. Why they did not put something like that in Wow, earning more talents with xp after 60, is beyond me. It was just such an obvious thing to do.

NO MODERN MMORPG SHOULD HAVE A CAP AT LAUNCH!
It is just RIDICULOUS. Everquest 1 has already shown us a better working "alternative." To ignore this, is backwards MMORPG game design stuck in the dark ages.

I poo on more classes/races/junk, without more character advancement it is moot. AHAH they are showing wow on G4, people killing stuff and junk.
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#22 Jul 12 2005 at 10:43 AM Rating: Decent
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Ok relax :)

I hit lvl60 a month back, and the game has never been more exciting, it all depends on what you expect of the game.

Supposing you got all the Uber gear you can dream of, and lvled to 60 in two months (unlikely), I think you miss the point of WoW, whether PvE or PvP it's a war between the Horde and the Alliance, hitting the lvl cap merely qualifies you to be the best you can to fight the Horde.

So what can you do when you're lvl60? I personally don't do instance runs anymore, I rather enjoy pvping on a PvE server (kinda regretful of not picking PvP from the start) PvP with all the different options (Raids/Capture the flag/Alterac/one on one) is basically like a very sophisticated Tekken with spells and professions and heals, and you gain rank, and theres an opposing "human" player swinging at you like theres no tomorrow, I don't think I'll get bored of that anytime soon.

But I do recognize that not all people see the same goal behind WoW, most actually seem to have "migrated" from other MMORPGs, and rather oblivious to WoW's history and base. Therefore, even for those, Blizzard is including more exciting features with every patch or two. Hero classes will be a whole different story when they're released.

In addition, I partially agree with you, the lvl60s should be kept at bay, and thats one of the reasons I believe that any future "standalone" expansion due at least 1-2 years from now, should raise the lvl cap and offer radically new material.
#23 Jul 12 2005 at 10:55 AM Rating: Good
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I also enjoyed PVP on a pve server, until battlegrounds came.

Before that we always had "instant join" pvp on my server, in a couple areas. You could go there at any time and jump in. I was a knight.

Since BG, i'm now down to master sergeant. I get on to play for a bit and the line for the battleground is hours, since I'm on the alliance side.

Because of BG, all of the horde who wish to PVP are in BG (which they can get into nearly instantly) This reminds me of the school dance, where every single girl is dancing but you have 7 guys who are "wallflowers." It doesn't even out.

Content, or other stuff to do, will simply never equal never capping out a character and having more ways to progress beyond loot or honor rank. This is the most FUNDAMENTAL thing I require from an mmorpg. It was my reason for playing from 1 through 59. It isn't "everything", but it is one of the main things. The fact that it simply stops at 60 is ridiculous.

It will be the number one reason for blizzard gradually losing more WoW players.

I disagree that what you say is the "goal" behind wow. It might be the only "goal" blizzard figured they needed, being naive with their first mmorpg. My main goal in these games is ALWAYS to continually progress with an ever growing character, constantly gaining more prowess through killing things.

To me, capping out and then just engaging in PVP turns the game into a combat FPS. Combat FPSes already exist, doing a much better job of ONLY doing that. It makes the entire point of it being a character growth game moot. Everyone gets 60, everyone then PVPS. If that is the case, you may as well just be playing a game where you start out equal to everone in which you never level but only PVP.

Raising the level cap, or adding hero classes, won't stop the problem. Just as everquest one found out, you can continually raise the cap forever but without some kind of alternate advancement its moot. Bored players, stagnating at 60 forever, will hit any new cap in 25 seconds. While even the most anti-casual player will take a long time to make a dent in an alternate advancement like XP sink system.

Hero classes will be hero classes. That is all blizzard has told us. So I can't really look forward to them too much, having no idea what they will actually be.

Edited, Tue Jul 12 11:57:38 2005 by natsuko
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#24 Jul 12 2005 at 9:49 PM Rating: Good
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I see what you're saying, What do you suggest? In specific
#25 Jul 12 2005 at 11:06 PM Rating: Good
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One more question : This thread had been started to see different people's ideas about what an expansion should be like.Not to critisize anybody's ideas, or to flame WoW. A little "I think that the lvl cap should be raised" or"room for everlasting improvement should be created" would have been enough.

Instead I got nuked after just 24 hours of starting to post here, and the whole thread got nuked ...

Edited, Wed Jul 13 00:11:55 2005 by GregoryTheWatcher
#26 Jul 12 2005 at 11:10 PM Rating: Good
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