It takes 26,000 hours to fully upgrade a Mythic weaponFollow

Sauromugue on beetles was one of the places you'd level up at before kazham existed.

Also, who said anything about exploring? It was simply that you could do it and that it worked.

And exping anywhere you want to exp still "works" today - in the same way that exping in Sauromugue "worked" when the place people preferred to exp was Kazam - ie. exping "anywhere" may not be ideal - but you can still get exp.

It isn't like when they put Abyssea and FoV in that they took exp from everything else.



Well then why were you disputing what I was saying about GoV? It isn't unreasonable to suppose that when you use an example of how fast YOU leveled to dispute my claims about GoV that you were also talking about GoV.



You know, if you think it is so unfortunate, why do you do it? There are other ways to level. It seems silly to complain about a leveling mechanic that is completely optional.

I've never leveled afk (other than maybe 15 minutes in abyssea while I ran out to grab a six pack and some pizza) because I've never been presented with the opportunity to do it honestly, and I'm not interested in doing it in a sneaky way.

The fact that other people do it doesn't bother me in the slightest - because no one is forcing me to level that way.

As for being useless at 75... actually... no. I mean you aren't AS useful - but you can still be some use. What I did on BST was go /whm - toss on MM, and heal, raise, -na etc. It was a page party, and we were short healers - so while I certainly wasn't as useful as the DDs that were two-shotting things - I was able to do a little bit to make the party run smoother.

As whm I was fully useful by 65.

As a BRD I'm pretty useless in abyssea at 95, so being useless at 75 didn't really bother me. Haste is nice though - and mazurka on the puller.

i dunno ADL drops some pretty nice stuff, same with DL. The real issue is that a lot ( i want to say majority) of players can't even access Xarc, let alone ADL, and id wager the majority also is unlikely to be able to make it to PW.

Then again I don't even know why Mythics enter the discussion at all, it is already the most tedious item to get in the game. Not even just the Alexandrite, the quest/mission style requirments are just as absurd. But focusing on Alex, SE needs to either lower the rate, or increase the mobs that generate this item considerably.

I understand that at the time it may have been comparable to Relics, but with the changes to dynamis and most jobs able to pull 100 pieces a day out SE needs to address the initial mythic requirements before they even touch the 99. Either Dynamis needs to drop them like candy or they need to look at Einherjahr as well. Mythics are completely messed up and have been since their inception, this is apparent by simple observation, and according to SE's census. I don't think ive ever seen a RDM in Murgelis for example, but have seen many in Alamace, Excalibur, and Mandau.

Edited, Dec 29th 2011 6:03pm by rdmcandie

And yet lvl 95 empyreans have already been created.

It's patently obvious that SE intends you to buy the plates, that's why they can be bought and sold.


Edited, Dec 30th 2011 12:16am by Lobivopis

Actually, I consider the RC planes a monumental waste of both time and money. Spending hundreds of dollars on a thing only to make it crash, then do it all over again? I'll pass.

RC planes are also real objects. They don't go away if you delete your character, or get banned because some GM was a moron, or the game shuts down. There's no dev team that will ever nerf them, or make you feel less "special" or cheapen your "accomplishment" by handing them out like candy. You don't have to keep paying rent to even look at them, let alone do something with them. If you get bored with them, you can (ethically) sell them. You can show them off to people who don't play your MMO or know anything about MMOs--if you try that with your uber-weapon in an MMO, people's eyes will glaze over as you rattle off a bunch of numbers they don't understand or care about as you dork out in your "my mans, let me show you them" mode.

eh technically those who created the model also created their own time parameters. Obviously the more time you invest the faster you can play with your toy. This is really no different then FFXI.

If you want consider the following, you get a model plane, you go through the process of building it, and you go through the process of painting it, and you go though the process of playing with it.... Then something unexpected happens it crashed, now you have to go through the process again or buy a new one.

Comparatively you pick up an MMO (any really as balance changes always provide a new "it model"). and you play a class, you build it from the ground up (leveling) you gear it to the nines (painting) and you play with it. Then one day out of the Blue powers outside your control cause it to become broken, bad, busted, and useless. You can either rebuild using the broken pieces and hope for the best, or you can pick up a new class and build it too.

Both are hobbies, one is no more caustic then the other, both require investments of time, and money. Where the problem exists is when your hobby controls your life, this is true in video games, and arts and crafts. (anything really including work!).

The difference lies in those able to maintain a life outside their hobby and in their hobby. A hobby is a hobby and no matter the nature it can take over peoples lives.

I'm not going to look into or dispute this because it doesn't really have to do with my point.

I don't know much anything about RC planes, but I'd be willing to bet most people who take it up as a hobby enjoy it while they're doing it and make their own rules about what they do with their hobby. It's sounds like a pretty open ended hobby.

If on the other hand, someone told this person "fly your plane from this building to that building and back over and over again" offering the all important sticker that I mentioned earlier after a year of repeating this task, it changes quite a bit. The person is probably no longer enjoying his hobby any more, he's just performing mindless repetitions of the same task so he can achieve some sort of status symbol. During this time, he could have been enjoying something, or become proficient at something, or increased his knowledge of something. Instead, he may as well have been doing nothing at all, and for what?

No sane person would waste a year of their lives flying a remote control plane back and forth in order to collect a status symbol. However, this sort of thing happens in FFXI fairly regularly.

Edited, Dec 30th 2011 5:27am by Susanoh

You're looking at the game through your subjective eyes only. Some of the content may be unachievable for you without an unhealthy addiction, this is true. However, not everyone is you, and not everyone is in the same position. Don't make assumptions about such things. This is the downfall of most people in the MMO world, MMO is a world where everyone must play by the same rules. That means that the person who works two jobs and goes to college, and only plays 2 hours a week, must play by the same rules and have the same set of goals to choose from as the person who's physically disabled and stuck at home all day living off government checks with nothing to do and no one to hang out with.

Would you say the latter, even if playing 10+ hours per day, has an unhealthy addiction? I've met people whose only escape from their frustrating life is online gaming. Would you take that away from them?

Bottom line is that there are a wide range of players in this game with a wide range of circumstances. The game has to account for all of them. Not just the hardcores, but also not just the casuals. You think you're arguing for inclusion, but you're actually arguing for exclusion. The game right now supports both casual & hardcore. You want a game that is built exclusively for casuals.

There's no reason why a casual should expect to have every single goal achievable to them in what they consider to be a practical amount of time. That's simply a selfish expectation. It's like going to the county fair and being angry that the harness on the ride you're getting on wasn't built for someone of your EXACT height. Well so sorry, but other people have to sit there too, ya know?



You are completely missing the point.

In either case, the goal was simply presented to the hobbyist. It's still up to them whether it's worth the investment or not. YOU HAVE TO DECIDE.

As long as people are doing them, clearly people view them as worthwhile for some reason or another. As long as that's true, all your arguments about how it's a colossal waste of time will amount to nothing more than whining.

If you aren't enjoying your current path through the game, you have only one person to blame and it's not Tanaka.

Let me first make one thing clear. This thread is specifically about the high level of time required to complete certain quests in this game. This isn't a relic upgrade thread that I came to derail and tell people to stop wasting their time. I'm offering my opinions to the topic at hand. It's no more or less whining to offer an opinion against large time sinks than it is to argue in favor of them, when that is the focal point of the discussion.

With that out of the way, of course it's up to the person to decide whether to take up the task. That goes without saying. I'm not telling people they have to use their time in a specific way. I am pointing out that MMOs have a way of encouraging people to use their time to repeat repetitive tasks that nobody likely would otherwise in order to obtain a status symbol. I'm pointing out that in performing these tasks, much of the time you don't increase your skills or knowledge of anything. I'm pointing out the incredible value of time; opportunity cost, the fact that any time you spend doing one thing could be spent doing another. There may be some people out there who would love tasks such as "defeat PW 500 times." If there are, I have not met them; most that I know don't complete any fight more than a dozen or so times unless they feel they "have to" (in fact, most that I know don't do it more than once unless they have to). But for those who don't find joy in quests like this, and just do it for the item, I would not be at all surprised if some day they look back and regret spending a chunk of their lives completing repetitions for virtual goods, especially once they have moved on with their lives and those goods become useless, whether that comes by way of player choice or the servers being shut down.

You missed the point, you got the same amount of experience. You cannot just go and level up in yuhtunga now, because there's absolutely zero reason to. You will not get anywhere near the amount of exp that you could be getting.


You seemed to forget that you were the one making a response. You called him out on something. I disputed that. We were talking about gaining levels and you brought up GoV. Just because you brought up GoV does not mean that we aren't allowed to talk about Abyssea.


Sarcasm, learn how to detect it.


Sneaky? I flat out said /p I'm gonna go to tbell with a friend, I'll be back in a bit. Did the part where I mentioned how a level 75 is completely useless confuse you and make you think I was able to contribute for some reason?


Actually, yes. I could have subbed my 15 whm if I wanted to. But it wouldn't have mattered. It also wouldn't have mattered if I had whm37 because there still would have been nothing to heal.


I'll give you this, since whm is is silly. All you need is level 61 and you can pretty much main heal. It's the exception though, not the norm.


There is no difference, and it's sad that you can't see that. It doesn't matter if it's in real life or in a game, it's all a meaningless hobby. But it's their hobby and they have fun doing it.


Personally, I think that making this game casual friendly ruined the game for all the "not normal" people who had loads of free time and put it into this game. That was the niche that ffxi had. If I wanted to play casually, I'd play games that don't require me to pay monthly just to play. (Or something like WoW.)

I got older and was no longer able to play the game with a hardcore mindset, thus the game was no longer for me and I accepted that.

That being said, overall I agree with the main point of your post. The content needs to be something that can be completed. You can't keep shoving AVs into your game and then telling the playerbase "It's totally doable, look we did it with 18 people!" when it can't be done.