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An Open Letter to Square EnixFollow

#102 Dec 13 2008 at 2:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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if your only means to make gil is by selling to NPC's, you have greater problems than this patch.

Try leveling a craft, try doing BCNM's, try camping NM's, try farming things where u have to sell to the AH.

There has to be a significant amount of gil coming from NPCs though or there wouldn't be any gil left at all.

SE keeps taking gil out of the system and slowing it's re-entry, but at some point there has to be a balance. If too little new money is coming into the economy (from quests, mobs, NPC sales, etc) then eventually we'd all run out of gil as the money we give to NPCs (shops, AH fees, chocobos, dynamis, etc) is more than what we get back.

Saying, farm new things, play the AH, craft, BCNM, is all well and good, but if NO ONE is getting a significant amount of money from NPCs there we'll all be completely broke very quickly.
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#103 Dec 13 2008 at 2:59 AM Rating: Good
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if your only means to make gil is by selling to NPC's, you have greater problems than this patch.


Almost all of my gil comes from NPCs.

Reason? No competition and instant results.

Almost every other means of making gil that involves some sort of a market has loads of other people looking to get a piece of it as well. Crafting, NMs, you name it. Either this makes the potential rewards less than they could be, it makes the rewards come in slower, or both.

In my book, if the economy were healthy, I would indeed be able to make much better gil by playing a market. But this is why NPCing stuff for gil exists in the game. It's supposed to be something players fall back to when the economy gets too deflated, as a means of bringing gil back into the economy. It keeps things from getting sold too cheaply on the market (Example: a stack of shihei bags cannot sell for much less than 30k on the AH, or else you'd end up making a greater profit by simply selling it to an NPC)
#104 Dec 13 2008 at 5:07 AM Rating: Decent
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PlanckZero wrote:
[quote]

[quote]Wow... you were planning to fund an entire relic weapon off npc'ing items?

Based on what people have been saying lets assume you were making 50k an hour farming bloods... Based on your estimate of 214800000g for a complete relic you were prepared for roughly 4300 hours of pure farming? And that's assuming you never run into competition and have reduced income or anything...

This particular means of farming was never meant to exist. Prior to the drop rate increase update they were worth sh*t and they have gone back to being worth sh*t. Aside from whiny people who apparently have never seen SE ***** over select groups of players before the world is no different than it was a month ago.



You really missed the point of my post. My point was two-fold; One - Relics cost way too much; and Two - If they keep taking away our legitimate money making methods, what are we left with?
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#105 Dec 13 2008 at 7:09 AM Rating: Decent
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You really missed the point of my post. My point was two-fold; One - Relics cost way too much; and Two - If they keep taking away our legitimate money making methods, what are we left with?


Complaining about the cost of relics really has no place in this thread. People are trying to make an argument that their only means of staying out of the poorhouse has gone down the drain and you're complaining that now you won't be able to spend millions upon millions on a fancy weapon.

And maybe you'd be left with all the other legitimate money making methods?

I mean the game did exist before the patch that increased the drop rate on all the bloods right?

And not every single person on every single server was farming this stuff right? So that means they must have some other ways of making gil.

Seriously, there wasn't this much ******** when SE nerf'd mistletoe and destroyed the remedy market, and we had actually sunken all of our time and effort into a craft to take advantage of that.
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#106 Dec 13 2008 at 7:53 AM Rating: Good
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Seriously, there wasn't this much ******** when SE nerf'd mistletoe and destroyed the remedy market, and we had actually sunken all of our time and effort into a craft to take advantage of that.


Well I think that was actually the start of the concern, but no one ******* because it was just one avenue of gil making.

But you add the mistletoe loss to the Bloods, demon drops, and bugard farming and all of a sudden you've removed a hell of a lot of common farming locations for folks.

If they'd just nerfed the bloods in Zitah, I don't think there would have been this degree of ire. It's been a cumulative thing that's gotten people a bit upset.

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#108 Dec 13 2008 at 8:05 AM Rating: Default
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This seems to be a pretty sensitive topic lately, with the people that used this method of earning gil being the most upset (or only ones upset). I think it's pretty short-sighted when people say this change is going to kill the game economy. Yes, if you continue to remove ways to create gil in the game without adding new ways to do it, it will eventually kill the economy, but who here actually thinks this is the last change SE will ever make that influences the economy?

Fixing an economy doesn't happen overnight, and it seems SE was taking care of the first immediate problem, but when the next problem becomes apparent, I'm sure another change will come along. If the reduction of NPC value of these items truly "kills" the economy, maybe they'll reduce some of the gil sinks in the game to compensate. Honestly, I believe some of the recent changes show that they're trying to help the economy rather than ruining it, even if they don't seem to have as much of an effect on the economy.

The Fields of Valor feature giving gil is one example. Sure, a few hundred gil really doesn't mean much, but they could have just as easily charged players to use Training Manuals because what player doesn't want bonus experience, even if it costs a handful of gil?

The removal of Jeuno bazaar tax could also be a sign of SE trying to help the economy, although it really wont have more than a minor effect since players have always found ways to get around that, but maybe we'll see a reduction of Jeuno AH fees in the future as well?

Perhaps they're wanting to drain a certain amount of gil out of the economy until it reaches a point they're wanting? Maybe they want the gil rewards from quests and missions to actually be valuable. As it is now, most players would be lucky to buy a decent piece of equipment at the level they would need to complete certain missions. Gil rewards should actually be rewards, I think, not pocket change.

Really, I think the people that are really bothered by this change should relax and see where things go. Find other ways to make gil. I've never relied on NPCs for gil, and I'm an extremely casual player, I never have hours to devote to the game like some do. If this change really disrupts your playstyle that much, just quit.

I don't think it's really as big of a problem as some of you make it out to be, you're just probably upset that your quickest source of gil is gone. If it really was that much of a problem, you would have quit the game by now because it would be 'impossible' for you to earn the gil you need to play, and you wouldn't be discussing this on a forum for a game you don't play anymore.
#109 Dec 13 2008 at 10:05 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
salvationinpurgatory wrote:
Quote:
Thief Knife patch.


JiggaJ wrote:
Why do people keep bringing this up? From what I remember of things at that time this was in fact one of the better patches they implemented into the game. That NM was almost as bad of a MPK breeding ground as DA was pre-bst patch. Seems there are still some people out there crying because they're "accomplishment" was some how diminished by making this weapon more available to everyone.


Why do people keep bringing it up? Hmm, lets see.

Pre patch:
The Thief's Knife was prestigious item that a handful of players spent numerous hours camping (hello 0/100+ horror stories), that was so bloody rare it was actually a symbol of your dedication to the job. Those who had it most likely spent hours inside that sh*thole temple.

Post patch:
Garbage thats worth less than a stack of Silk Threads...


Maybe thats why people keep bringing it up?


So your dedication to a job is determined by how many hours you're willing to spend in a tiny room trying to outclaim several other players to obtain an item that only increases the chances of getting more drops by a small percentage?

Do you collect gear to achieve a sense of personal accomplishment or as an attempt to impress others? Because quite honestly if it's the former, then it wouldn't matter if SE decided to give every person on the server a Thief knife. In the end you'd still know how yours was obtained and nothing would take away from that.
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#111 Dec 14 2008 at 11:11 AM Rating: Default
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Quote:
Talk to me when 50 million gil of yours turns to 15k with a little change in code.


I take it you bought yours or made gil by selling them. Either way your point is moot. We've all had to deal with rising and falling costs on both sides of the counter (so to speak). There was a good amount of people that made gil by camping and selling Emperor hairpins and Leaping boots before those were changed to a Rare/Ex status.

And I'm sure there isn't a single person in this game that hasn't purchased an item only to have it depreciate later. Igqira Weskit anyone?

So what exactly were you complaining about?
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#112 Dec 15 2008 at 4:42 AM Rating: Good
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I concur w/ the OP.

My suggestion is to document the RMT, but allow them to continue their ways. There's two sides to this equation, and which ban would be more effective? The casual player who's too lazy to even farm gil? Or the RMT that feeds his kids by finding ways to avoid SE's attempts to thwart him? Removing either one of these will eliminate the other.

The economy is terrible. It's incredibly difficult to make money in this game right now utilizing the Auction House. If this is SE's way to stimulate the AH economy, you missed your mark. Players as a whole are mostly idiots when it comes to economics, so you cannot expect the economy to fix itself. I would recommend temporary AH controls be installed to slowly stimulate the economy and bring life back into the "SE-approved" gil making methods. For example, limit the amount an item can be listed above and below the average of the last 10 sold. Say no more than 30% over and 10% below. It won't be an overnight change but within a year or so the controls may be able to be removed (kinda doubt it though).
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#114 Dec 15 2008 at 7:03 PM Rating: Decent
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Quote:
salvationinpurgatory wrote:
Quote:
Talk to me when 50 million gil of yours turns to 15k with a little change in code.


I take it you bought yours or made gil by selling them. Either way your point is moot. We've all had to deal with rising and falling costs on both sides of the counter (so to speak). There was a good amount of people that made gil by camping and selling Emperor hairpins and Leaping boots before those were changed to a Rare/Ex status.

And I'm sure there isn't a single person in this game that hasn't purchased an item only to have it depreciate later. Igqira Weskit anyone?

So what exactly were you complaining about?

Actually I farmed it...1/8


If that was the case, then where exactly does gil come into it?
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